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To clarify, the word average was quoted in the thread title "Sympathy for the AVERAGE American." This is why I included the word average, not as a mathematical statement. Some have suggested that Americans (average or otherwise) are not worried about Trump, so my point is that come the midterms, we will know what they do think or at least what those who vote think.

As there is a thread about Chump already, how about we make this about the "average American". Firstly, what is the "average American"? Or do we mean the stereotypical middle class American - and even this is hard to define as their preferences and attitudes can vary differently between states. But how does this correlate to their rise in economic and political power? And concentration of that economic and political power. Don't forget, the US economy was originally built on some of the most oppressive largesse compared to its peers - slavery, suppression of workers rights, etc. Even today, not a rise since 2009 of the minimum wage.. very little leave entitlements, virtually no redundancy rights, etc. at least compared to its peers. And let's not forget, the leader in a democracy, of which it still was in 2025 when Chump was elected, is the result of a majority of votes or seats or states or whatever, in accordance with the electoral laws and systems. In this case, in 2025, Chump was able to attract the popular majority of voters as well as states. Yep, I feel sorry for the Democrat voters, and for America not having what it considered a better option. But ultimately, they knew what he was going to do, knew he would do it and some cited that is why they voted for him. As a result, I don't feel so sorry for the Americans.. they made theiur bed (if not all of them - but that is how it works). In fact, I could argue the current administration doesn't break with their historical past, particularly with respect to avarice. I do feel sorry for the rest of the world (or at least the US allies) that bought into the US, had no say, and now have to deal with the fallout.

And how is that looking so far? As I understand it, the memorandum of understanding which lasts for 60 days, does not include handing over nuclear materials. It does seemingly involve unfreezing billions dollars of assets for the Iranians. I also understand that the Iranians have not ruled out charging tolls for ships using the Strait of Hormuz. Then there is regime change. This has not occurred, but several leaders have been killed, and it is believed their replacements are even harder line. The US has squandered its arsenal of weapons such as the Tomahawk Missile, which will take years to replenish. https://militarywatchmagazine.com/article/us-indefinitely-suspends-tomahawk-japan#:~:text=The United States has indefinitely,day U.S. assault on Iran. "The United States has indefinitely suspended the delivery of Japan’s first 400 RGM-109 Tomahawk cruise missiles, due to serious shortages of the missiles in the U.S. Navy that have resulted from the 39 day U.S. assault on Iran. " It would be a great time for China to take Taiwan. But I guess if Americans are feeling down because of increasing healthcare costs, high petrol prices, etc. I am sure they are massively cheered up by the bulldozing of the East Wing to build that big, Beautiful Ballroom to be used by the ultra-rich. MMmmmm you've got to love all that gold leaf. I bet they they cant wait for the Arch De Trump or to get their first $250 bill with the dear leader's face on. I am sure they are so proud of the immense intelligence of the leader. So smart that he aces tests that are used to detect dementia. But of course, the doctor administering the test has never seen such a perfect score.

It had entered for the Pullet's Surprise award.. Nev

The ABC has a very good and highly relevant article on the current death of democracy, brought about by a common failure to tax billionaires, which leads to autocracy, and therefore excessive concentration of important decision-making power, into a small number of unelected super-rich people. What the article fails to include, is the point that concentration of wealth in just a few peoples hands, leads to a constant cost squeeze on the middle class and working class, who end up bearing the brunt of the taxation payments. https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-06-17/democracy-cannot-survive-trillionaires-gabriel-zucman-elon-musk/106798842

Whoa.. There were a few spicy pages I just caught up on. 🙂 I think it is fair to say the two party system is in transition. To what - who knows? I will leave the performance of Albo and his crew to the appropriate thread. However, it is clear that there is a perception that neither of the two majors are truly representing the majority of Aussies at the moment. And, from the polls, it is clear the libs at least (and possibly the Nats) aren't thought to be at all representing their traditional base. Labor, at least federally, seem to be not too far off their normal primary vote; I read it was somewhere around the 28% mark; not too much lower than the last federal election of, from memory, about 32%. At the same time, there is a perception (real or otherwise) that the gap is ever widening between the haves and have nots and that blame is being successfully laid at the feet immigration, which plays into both fear and bigotry. This is because more and more of what was the middle class is being squeezed more and more. For various reasons, which would take a book to go through, blame has successfully been laid at the feet of immigration. This results in a perception the immigrants are taking away previous little resources that the majority of the population have to fight for, and along comes Pauline with her silver bullet fixes to everyone's problems. The Libs had their time and between Morrison and Dutton (with a little Littleproud thrown in), screwed things up so royally, they were booted out (Albo technically won, but in the famous words of Bill Hayden - a drover's dog would have won that election). To his credit, he took an early lump in the form of the Voice, licked his wounds, and then did a reasonable job. But hubris seems to be setting in (early) as it inevitably does, and he is no longer looking like he is really looking after the majority of the people he purports to represent. Having said that, the loss of primary vote is probably not much more than a protest vote - yet. The Libs seem to be so far removed from reality, that all but their most ardent supporters seem to have jumped ship. It's hard to understand precisely what they stand for. If I was a betting person, I would suggest in 5 - 10 years, without a complete about-face, they will fade into oblivion. Which may leave a two party system - Labor and Phon.. Or more likely, some other party will spring up as the Greens seem to be marginalising themselves (or at least no one is covering them much anymore). Or there may be more parties, in which case it is likely to become lie some European countries where coalitions are formed and broken. Whilst I support the key budget changes on economic grounds, there is a lot more that can be done. And, people like David Pocock are using social media effectively to get a message across of what is wrong with Labor and the LNP. Just google or youtube him and you will see what I mean.

If they interview the bird, maybe it can answer that age-old question of why it was crossing the road...

As the 4th July 2026 approaches, I feel sorry for the average American. That will be the day they celebrate the 250th anniversary of the signing of the Declaration of Independence, which they hold as being the date of the creation of their nation. Actually, independence from the Kingdom of Great Britain was gained on 3rd September, 1783 with the signing of the Treaty of Paris, whereby the British monarchy acknowledged the independence of the Thirteen Colonies, leading to the establishment of the United States as an independent and sovereign nation. Be that as it may, sometime in 2026 the American people get to celebrate the creation of their nation. From 1775 to 1781 battles were fought by the residents of the Thirteen Colonies to gain independence from Great Britain. From 1783 those residents and millions of migrants who arrived as free persons or slaves built a nation that by the 20th Century became the most powerful amongst nations, held in awe by all others. That was until the begining of 2025 when a freely elected government set about destroying it through avarice which led to the engaging in all sorts of activities considered to be corrupt and/or authoritarian. As a result of those activities, the shining light that was American Democracy has been dulled. I well remember how in 1976 the American people celebrated the 200th anniversary of their Nation's founding. It was a time of great happiness. I am so sad that in 2026, the American people cannot celebrate this further milestone with the same degree of happiness, all due the the actions of a narcissist who never possessed the abilities required of the leader of a Nation. One can only hope that by the 275th anniversary, the American nation has recovered from its present situation.

My eldest son is 18 today. Couldn't be prouder of the fine young man he's become. 😊

I guess we might get a feel for how the average American (voter) feels in November.

On the basis that current aged voters would die out, yes. But it ignores two other things. First, and less likely, the new found popularity of one nation will result in those offspring and impressionable of those new found voters being conditioned into following... Of course, most of the new found voters probably have adult kds where it is too late (hence, less likely). But, as we age, our ideology tends to change - usually moderate more than flip.. But there are enough people on the boundaries that may keep PHON in popularity or even increase it (assuming every other factor stays the same). I just mentioned it as a possible outcome, but if UK experience is anything to go by - and indeed US experience - the electorate may well have had enough that something really bad has to happen before they change their tune. On any other electoral system, Farage and UK Reform would possibly be the second or likely third party in the UK House of Commons today - straight past the post averted that. Chump is in because of the protest vote - the die-hard MAGA base is not enough to give them more than a few states (yes, Chump is Republican, but lets face it, their national elections are usually based on the presidential candidates). Pauline#s rise is not dissimilar to Farage's.. disenfranchised population, structural unfairness, immigration concerns, etc. And now, a rise in the polls; the difference is Reform are now polling ahead of anyone else. Both parties have the same issues - candidate vetting is terrible, controlled by billionaires and open about it, offering cheap solutions to difficult problems, etc. It is likely, unless Labour in the UK turn things around quickly, Reform will be the next government (Conservatives are in the same position as the Libs). Then the shit will hit the fan and as the British are less rusted on, Reform will hopefully implode before they can do too much damage, or will at least be booted out and we will never hear of them or their people again. Although Albo is far less unpopular than Starmer, it is plausible that without Labor turning it around, Pauline could make a decent go of it at the next election.. definitely not a majority, but with preferential voting, you may well see quite a few One Nation taken seats in the House of Reps. That would give her enough to make a dent, but not enough to extend them the rope to hang themselves (metaphorically to those sensitive to Pauline). If Labor continue, then as long as ON don't royally screw up, they could be in for a treat in 2031. It is not that far away (and assuming no early elections called). At the polls stand today, they look to be the majority party on a "two-party" preferred basis, where if one substituted them for the Libs/Nats in that race. As it is, they are polling well ahead of the Lib/Nats. Once they are in, if they are, like Reform, they would likely screw everything up and we will never hear of them again. So, while I agree, they are a fringe riding a wave of discontent, there is a more than tight probability they will become a major at the next election and the libs will pay for it. Agreed. this is the major reason for voter discontent; it's just the billionaires are great at getting a manipulated message out to the population it is identity politics (pick whatever you like) that is the problem. She had so many "I don't do policy on the run" responses to basic policy questions - I would put her more like Joe BP - "Don't you worry about that!"

From the Shovel (a satirical mag, in case you had to ask) .....

Minority government has been fairly common until Labor's big seat haul. In some ways I think it works better, they have to negotiate to get things done. The problem is of course that if the LNP is in power they negotiate first with the far right parties. If Labor is in they usually negotiate with the Greens first which gives better outcomes. While having a majority does give them the ability to make good reform, like these CGT discount changes, it can lead to complacency which then gets punished at the next election.

It seems like most of the political journos are writing and saying that the rise of One Nation has meant the end of the two party system as we've known it. It might come to that, where we have three main parties for a period of time. Or One Nation could flame out, the coalition eventually rebuilds, and we're back to the old two party system. I don't follow European politics much, but some of those countries seem to have multi parties and they try to cobble together a coalition of parties after the election to get a governing majority. It makes me wonder if that's the direction we're heading here in Australia.

I laughed at the suggestion that an average can be decided my a simple 52%. Totally agree the pass mark for legislation should be higher than 51%. Wouldn't work for the initial election but it would encourage realistic debate instead of party bullying. Anyway, back to sympathy. Is it morally acceptable to only have sympathy for some Americans, based on their (unknown) voting?

octave, I'm not sure what average means when applied to voting. I'm not good at mathematics, so hopefully someone can explain it to me. Most elections, even what they term landslide elections, have very little in vote percentage between the winners and losers. If the Democrats have a 52% vs 48% win, does that mean that 52% are average voters and 48% are not average voters.

That's good. 18 is not very old but he's got through some difficult bits by now, no doubt. Nev

GON, have you been following Trump's performance recently? The average American, traditional or otherwise, wants him gone because he's making such a mess of everything. He's sinking the ship, not righting it. He was a failure as a businessman and he's proving to be a failure as a president. He's lost his war in Iran and is struggling to get out of it. He's just celebrated 250 years of American democracy by staging a cage fight at the White House. In a way, it seems quite appropriate given the way he's managed to fracture the country. The only thing he's really good at is lying and getting rich through corruption, although to be fair, the average American doesn't much like the Democrats either.

ome, you only need to feel sorry for the approximate half of them that voted Democrat. For the rest that voted Republican, some might have some regrets but the majority are glad to be rid of Democrat government. I've had some personal experience with it as I have friends who are American, and my stepfather's two sons by his first marriage live in the U.S. and are married to Americans. Their views all vary a bit. A mate who was out here last year just before he passed away had been a Republican voter until he lost the right to vote, so he didn't vote in the Trump election. He broadly supported the Republicans and was fairly neutral on Trump. On the other hand, his older brother is a Republican and absolutely hates Trump but will still vote Republican over Democrat.

Even if Trumps deal works we still won't be Back to what we had before his Adventures in Iran Commenced .There's too much Infrastructural damage done for that to happen. Nev

GON, the rest of your post makes me think that the traditional Americans who might reply to that question seem are zealous MAGA members. I'm sure that if you posed the same question to any other American the response would be quite different. Fabian socialist: Fabian socialists believe in achieving socialist goals—such as social justice, economic equality, and universal public services—through gradual, democratic reform rather than revolutionary upheaval. The movement emphases that systemic change is best accomplished through incremental legislative and institutional policies.

That light is probably the most useful part of a Cossac/Voshkod bike.

It's a big step to suggest ON is a 'main party'. So far, they seem more of a lingering fringe party. Sure, there is a possibility of it happening as protest votes get louder. The other parties don't show much desire to control their corruption, nor to get in touch with the electorate.

Greens are fairly stable on 12% - according to a recent article about why they're not benefiting from the downturn in major party support, their support is increasing in the Gen Z cohort but simultaneously decreasing in the older generation. Which, going forward, should be a net increase.

I had a closer look at the old headlight that was bolted to that Ural frame. A small trademark on the lens identified it as an Everwing brand which was the brand of headlights supplied to Datsun. Googling Datsun photos pins the age down to anywhere between the early thirties and early fifties, either from a Datsun car or Datsun light truck. It's a nice old headlight and quite big, about 200mm wide across the front and around 180mm centre of lens to the rear.

Yes, John Howard found that out the hard way. He finally got a majority in the Senate allowing them to pass legislation at will, brought in work choices and got walloped for it. At least that's the way I remember it if someone can correct me.

In karate there's a short punch - not sure how it's spelled, but they pronounce it "shitozuki". I commented to another student tonight that I used to own a shit Suzuki, and that was also a short stroke (GS750F). Man that was a crap bike.

The new ones are a handy thing but certainly a bit expensive. For the last two or three years the ones imported here with left hand sidecars have the gear up option, which is 2WD on demand with the sidecar wheel driving for dirt road/off road use. It's a straight drive, non differential. Before that it was only the Russian/European/U.S. models with the right hand sidecar that had the 2WD option due to the drive shaft being on the right hand side. The new ones drive a lot better with a sidecar compared to the old ones that had telescopic fork front ends. The newer leading link setup pushes the front wheel as far forward as legal and makes them behave a lot better. They're headquarted in the U.S. now and have moved production from Russia to Kazakhstan to get around the war sanctions.