COVID-19 Virus.

[facthunter]

Numbers of passengers coming by air into WA reduced  today. Most think a similar thing to Victoria could break out anywhere. It aerosols. The steam you give out on a cold morning indicates the extent of it. The genetics indicate it's origin and where it's been.

   There was a term used in Psychology when I studied it in the 60's called "selective perception", where you see and hear pretty much what you prefer to or are more comfortable with. Today to complicate matters, deception and falsities are turned into an art form. Truth is more hidden than ever, but if you love it, and seek it, you will find more of it. Nev.

[octave]

Lately I have been thinking that folks have began to believe the the worst was over. I have been sceptical about this.   More than likely the virus still circulates even in areas that have not had a confirmed case in recent weeks.    I think that whilst the Victorian situation is the result of mistakes it does indicate the the virus was there waiting for a misstep. Countries that have been held up as great role models such as Singapore are having a resurgence,  

 

I have been reading today about how long  immunity lasts when someone has had covid, it would seem for most it could be as little as 3 months. This means that the notion that if enough people get it we will attain herd immunity.could be a false hope.   

 

The only real solution is the scientific one - a vaccine. 

[Marty_d]

Not to mention that scientists are now saying the WHO is behind the game and as Nev says, it's actually aerosol-ized.  (Is that a word?)

This means that the miniature droplets are small enough to be more affected by air movement than by gravity, so they can hang around inside a room for up to 16 hours and have been found more than 4m from hospital patients.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if we see requirements for face masks in public places and on public transport soon.

[nomadpete]

Marty. How dare you!

That would clearly infringe everybody's civil rights!!!!

 

[Marty_d]

3 minutes ago, nomadpete said:

Marty. How dare you!

That would clearly infringe everybody's civil rights!!!!

 

But on the positive side, apparently they make you look like the Lone Ranger.  (After he'd swapped the horse for a couch and a supply of Macca's for 40 years.  And sent Tonto south of the wall.)

Edited July 7, 2020 by Marty_d

[nomadpete]

Furthermore, I'd suggest that all the expert medical opinion has been acknowledging that a respiratory virus is spread via aerosols (either suspended in air or by contact after the aerosols settle on surfaces). We were also informed that the virus can live on solid surfaces for many hours. Logically, therefore, it will survive many hours whilst suspended in moist exhaled breath. That is why the experts all insisted upon 'social distancing'.

 

So it shouldn't surprise anyone to hear that this virus can spread by air movement, air conditioning, or similar.

 

 But For some reason, the same experts have been telling everyone that Covid-19 is NOT spread by aerosols. And therefore wearing a  mask is a waste of time.

 

That's a clear contradiction.

 

It leads me to be cautious about blindly accepting the word of the experts.

 

How did Tonto creep into the conversation?

Edited July 7, 2020 by nomadpete

[red750]

A vaccine worn't cure it, just like it didn't cure the flu.

[kgwilson]

Flu vaccines only work for the strain they were created for & even then the success rate is only around 55%. It was only about 20% successful a  couple of years ago due to the mutating virus becoming resistant to that years vaccine. It remains to be seen how SARS-Cov2 mutates over time & what success they have with the multitude of vaccines and remedies being tested right now.

[old man emu]

10 hours ago, kgwilson said:

the mutating virus becoming resistant to that years vaccine.

And that is the reason that thinking that we will develop resistance to the virus is a false hope. We have suffered from the Common Cold since Pontius as a Pilate. More than 200 different viruses (rhinovirus - virus of the nose) are known to cause the symptoms of the common cold. Strategies for combating rhinoviruses will depend on a better understanding of rhinovirus diversity and evolution. 

 

Researchers have sequenced the complete genomes of 70 known human rhinoviruses and 10 others from nasal-wash samples of patients with rhinovirus upper respiratory tract infections. The final collection, including the previously published sequences, consisted of 138 full-length human rhinoviruses genomes. Rhinoviruses contain all their genetic information on a single strand of RNA (a molecule related to DNA). The researchers found that all the virus RNA strands feature a cloverleaf-like shape at one end. Nearly every virus had a unique sequence in a section of this region. Analogous regions in related viruses have been shown to affect how pathogenic the viruses are. The researchers believe this stretch of sequence might play a similar role in rhinoviruses.

[facthunter]

Have an extensive monoculture and disease will spread within it, eventually.. The disease will eventually become resistant to a cure which is used repeatedly. Run a farm and you will find this out, unless you mind is somewhere else entirely, and you are "hooked" on chemicals. Work with nature instead of trying to absolutely control it. We want simplistic FIXES for everything instead of understanding the(complex) reasons underlying the causes. There's far too many of us and we are FOULING our Planet. It's run like a BAD Puppy farm. Nev

Edited July 8, 2020 by facthunter
more content.

[onetrack]

I'm always intrigued as to why cruise ships are a petri dish for viruses - rhinoviruses, novaviruses, and now COVID-19. There must be something about that environment that is perfect for them on every level.

Never been a fan of ship cruising, but you couldn't get me on a cruise ship today, if you dragged me on.

[spacesailor]

It,s the best way to travel, if your not RICH.

Fly to a destination then pay bid bucks for the hotel, ect.,

Come by boat, like all good people do, and have the band greet you at the dock-side. All sorts of ship-board entertainment, great food and your ownbed for each night .

spacesailor

[red750]

The trouble is many people don't sleep in t heir own bed.

 

I know this is not a dictatorship (my daughter keeps telling me so), but this thing has been handled very poorly, and the state government may pay the price at the next election.Dan's popularity is at an all time low.

 

What should have happened when the spike started in the northern suburbs hotspot was that a state of emergency be declared, making it compulsory for everyone to be tested, and that the police have the authority to arrest people who refuse or disobey the isolation rules, lock them up till the restrictions are lifted then proceed with summons for breaching isolation and lockdown rules. There were people even today, coming out of the North Melbourne towers that have been locked down and fighting with police. Scenes almost like the George Floyd arrest. Private security guards and airline staff should not be used for this type of role. Police, protective services and ADF personnel should have been called in immediately.

[spacesailor]

Maybe it will break-up those Melbourne gangs, the media were telling us about not so long ago .

spacesailor

[old man emu]

What annoys me is that I can be infected by some arrogant bastard who doesn't care for anyone but them self.

[Jerry_Atrick]

The UK eased its lockdown on Saturday; I went to get the Fish and Chips for the Satruday evening (a ritual at our place) and the pub next door was heaving - not too many payuing attention to social distancing from what I could see.. unless there are 20 odd people living in the same household and about the same age. Thankfully, I live in the south west, which has fared well (except our neighbours had it.. but was expected as they are consultants at the local hospital). Unfortunately, I live in the South West and summer holidays started for a lot of private schools and the grockles (local clang for tourists) were down here in their droves.. so I kept well away from anyone..  I am all sure yuo saw the Bournemouth beach fraca a week or so ago.. guess what.. COVID-19 is on its way back.. And in a couple of weeks, I expect it to be a small second wave...

 

Agreed @old man emu, selfish appendages of the male anatomy are screwing it up for everyone... BTW.. have never felt so concerned since the outbreak about going out in public...

[red750]

I just received this on Facebook. Pretty sobering.

 

For people who don't understand what it means to be on a ventilator but want to take the chance to go back to work....For starters, it is NOT an oxygen mask that is put over the mouth while the patient comfortably lies down and reads journals.

Ventilation for Covid-19 is a painful intubation that goes down your throat and stays there until you live or you die.
It is done during anaesthesia for 2 to 3 weeks without moving, often upside down, with a tube deposited from your mouth up to the airpipe and allows you to breathe to the rhythm of the lung machine.

Patient can't talk or eat or do anything natural - the machine keeps you alive.
Discomfort and pain they feel from this means that medical experts must administer sedatives and pain meds to ensure pipe tolerance as long as the machine is needed.

It's like being in an artificial coma.

After 20 days from this treatment, a young patient loses 40 % muscle mass and gets trauma in the mouth or voice cords, as well as possible lung or heart complications.
It is for this reason that old or already weak people can't stand treatment and die.

Many of us are in this boat... so stay safe if you don't want to take the chance to end up here. This is NOT the flu!
They put a tube in your stomach, either through your nose or skin for liquid food, a sticky bag around your butt to collect diarrhea, one to collect urine, an IV for liquids and meds, an A-line to monitor your BP it is completely dependent on finely calculated with doses, teams of nurses, CRNA and MA to move your limbs every two hours and lie on a carpet circulating ice cold liquid to help reduce your 40° degree temp.

All of this while your loved ones cannot even come to visit. You will be alone in a room with your machine. Or your mother will. Or your father. Or your son or daughter. Or wife or husband.

But... you think wearing a mask is uncomfortable and humiliating.

 

[Admin]

Just took my Son to work, he works casual at Nandos, plus just had a phone call from my daughter who is also at work, Caitlin works casual at Adairs bed linen etc. When I dropped Lachlan off the Northland shopping centre was packed, as normal...there was no difference in the traffic on the roads and Caitlin says she is much busier than normal...ALL OF THIS WHEN WE ARE IN LOCKDOWN 

 

The Victorian Premier has in my opinion lost any and all credibility.

[willedoo]

In some cases they do a tracheotomy and insert the tube that way. It's a bad thing.

[facthunter]

Ian, are you blaming Andrews because OTHERS are not doing the right thing? Vic was vilified for delaying going to normal. ALL states have different circumstances as things progress/develop and it's all pretty unknown. I think it's pretty reprehensible when something as serious as this is is still politicised for all it's worth instead of co operating for the best outcome  Most of the World is far worse off than WE are That's NOT an accident.Nev

[Admin]

Nev, I am saying that he has lost all credibility with the people of Vic hence why people are no longer listening to him. He blamed the Fed Gov initially months ago and now he is blaming the people. He lost all credibility with me a few years ago when it was proven that he was corrupt back with the legal Euthanasia time. He kept refusing to even listen to the Legal Euthanasia group and in one statement said they were wrong. When his own father dies he supported them and pushed it through. Now it seems whatever he wants he will do and stuff everyone else and what they believe...what about all the other groups he won't listen to unless he himself gets something out of it. The guy along with the whole labour Party (Stacking) is corrupt, arrogant and is sending the State broke AGAIN...anyone got a spare 1.3 billion dollars YES 1.3 BILLION DOLLARS that he wasted on the Eastern Freeway contract cancellation...my kids are going to be paying for that 1.3 billion dollars plus all the wasted money he has spent since for years.

 

I remember years ago when Kennett first got in after the Labour Party...they cooked the books and Kennett had to go on TV, almost in tears, saying the State was broke and Labour had again lied to the Victorian people...how many more Labour Politicians are corrupt and what do they do, appoint OTHER LABOUR PEOPLE to investigate their own corruption...what a joke...My Great Great etc Grandfather was the first Chief Constable of Police for Victoria and I am a direct descendant of the First Fleet and Victoria was the home of all my descendants since, and I am the last with all my family now moved interstate...I will soon be as well, for the sake of my children and their children

[facthunter]

You must read the Sun Herald and listen to 3 AW to interpret it for you? .I watch each direct presentation by Andrews and can't read what you do into it.. I've enjoyed Jeffs company but we are still  paying for the privatisation of everything he sold off like the electricity network. I still think its near treasonous to politicise this right in the middle of a crisis such as this is.There's time to go over it after we get it covered properly.. I don't see anything being covered up and he's in accord with all medical advice. There's been consistent interference in this states affairs by Turnbull ,Dutton . and Morrison ALL I read into that is they must think he's a threat to them . and they are deliberately working at discrediting him. . It's a technique they use a lot.  I'm sorry you and I don't see eye to eye on this one . We've been through a lot together.Nev

[Admin]

Sorry Nev, haven't read the Herald Sun for many many years and have never ever listened to 3AW. There use to be a saying started by The Age Newspaper:

If you can't think...read The Herald (evening newspaper many years ago)

If you can't read...look at The Sun (morning newspaper many years ago)

- They merged together to become The Herald Sun

 

But Nev, how do we know that he IS IN FACT listening to Health Professionals...we have already heard reports that he is brow beating them just like his arrogance in his media reports and as reported in special editorials in the important newspapers (The Australian) and even today the TV stations (Channel 9) are making negative editorial statements about him

 

Sorry Nev, having spent the last many years working in Gov I am hearing different things from ex-colleagues than perhaps you are but I agree, we will have to agree to disagree on this one

 

[Admin]

Just been talking to Corrine...now to put this into perspective Corrine is absolutely flat out from 9am to 9pm every day at the moment providing remedial services to health professionals (Nurses specialists etc), Police etc...Corrine has just told me that every one of them is in so much rage, stress and deteriorating mental health because they say the Premier just won't listen to them and never has throughout this whole Pandemic. So there you go...also straight from the mouths of Health Professionals and Police.

 

Since when has the words that come out of a politicians mouth ever been the truth and why is there so much backlash against him now...because people are starting to hear the real truth...he has to go and today would not be too soon

[octave]

How has Victoria's response differed from other states and what advice has the Victorian Government ignored?