Crazy Drivers

[skippydiesel]

Others may have made the following observations/rant - if so I apologise in advance.

 

What is it with Australian drivers that they:

 

Must drive as far to the right as possible. This includes multi lane roads of all descriptions (right lane hoger's), but can also be observed on single lane roads -hugging the crown and where there are passing lanes - immediately move into right lane without any apparent condition that would warrant it.

 

Do not understand how traffic circles work. It's been somewhere in the vicinity of 40 years since they were first introduced and it is still common to have people stopping when not required to do so, changing lanes when not supposed to, not indicating or using the wrong indicator sequence.

 

Unable/unwilling to reverse park and then blaming the car for reversing out over the kid/dog/ play things/ causing an accident at the shopping centre/etc.

 

Doing a "swan neck" turn when turning left/right - the worst I have seen ,involved entering the "hard" shoulder to conduct a right turn, also common to cross solid white lines to turn left.

 

When manoeuvring; not indicate at all, indicate after or during manoeuvre, feel that 2-3 flashes is sufficient.

 

Are so "panicked" by a sign indicating that the left lane will end within 500 m, that a sudden sharp (speed not a factor) turn into the right lane is required usually without/limited warning indicator.

 

On approaching a speed reduction sign, apply hard braking as if suddenly caught unawares of the change in conditions.

 

Drive, often erratically, well below the posted speed limit, without any consideration to the queue forming behind them (may be towing a caravan/ driving a motor home - not exclusive to this group).

 

Drive at speed & close to; playing children / livestock/ cyclists.

 

Ignore prolonged signal for an intention to change lanes or worse, actually manoeuvre to prevent the change.

 

To compound this we;

 

Have (often local council) road rules that require/facilitate the wrong behaviour e.g. the many parking zones that require front parking/the traffic circles that direct "turning" traffic into the wrong lanes.

 

50 kph zones on "through" roads, often for a ridiculous distance before/after buildings.

 

Stop signs, where good visibility & low traffic speeds exist.

 

Give way signs, where poor visibility and high traffic speeds exist.

 

Recommended max cornering speeds that are so inconsistent as to be laughable/dangerous.

 

Road work signs/zones where no work is being conducted.

 

Have passenger rail "drop off zones" so far from the station that anyone with luggage/small children are placed at considerable disadvantage.

 

AND, completely illogically, we accept the authorities obsession with speed, as the primary factor in traffic incidents.

 

RANT over (for the moment)

[old man emu]

we accept the authorities obsession with speed, as the primary factor in traffic incidents.

 

You aren't wrong with all that you have said above, and you have not exhausted the list of crook driving.

 

Claiming that speed is a primary factor in traffic incidents is gross ignorance. Of course speed is involved in traffic incidents. No movement - No incident. Claiming that enforcement of speed limits reduces traffic incidents is a blatant cover for the fact that strict enforcement of speed limits is merely a tax grab.

 

It is rare indeed to see anyone pulled over by police in the cause of driver education. The focus on speed is still paramount, with numerous fixed cameras, a latter-day sprinkling of roving ones, and police cars parked beside the safest highways. They reap massive sums in speeding fines, but have no demonstrable effect on driver skill or education.

 

Who hasn't been booked for doing 50 in a school zone at 3:45 pm? The kids are all at home on their Playstations by then. It's a waste of time to ask police to crack down on speeding and hooning on residential streets because "all the fatalities happen on the open roads".

 

While ever State governments include traffic fine revenue in their budgetry income forecasts, the obsession with "Speed Kills" will continue.

[red750]

On 10/03/2020 at 9:17 PM, old man emu said:

Who hasn't been booked for doing 50 in a school zone at 3:45 pm?

There is a road at the end of our street which runs past a secondary school. The speed limit is 40 kph, 24/7. Supposedly because kids might be going the the basketball building or sports grounds at any time. The street also has speed humps, roundabouts or chicane.

 

[red750]

Industry insider Dan Ufer has urged drivers to "reduce your risk of being at fault" in any carpark fender bender with one helpful tip, saying drivers should always reverse into a parking spot. Why? Because reversing out with limited vision could increase the chance of a collision and in a two car prang, the reversing driver is always deemed responsible.

 

"It’s best practice to reverse park into a car park because if you’re reversing, you’re 100 per cent always at fault," the Queenslander explained.

[facthunter]

Double the speed. 4 times the Kinetic Energy. It's the velocity change that does the damage. That's the logic., In modern cars you don't get the sensation of speed you did in the cruder old cars. Inattention is the main cause of increased accidents on our roads and who drives well enough to get out of a skid skilfully?  Not many.   Nev

[spacesailor]

Two ' grandsons ' of forumit's here. 

Are great at " drifting " .

One Eastern Creek Sydney,  the other Darwin .

MY grandson went to Japan  for a few runs at their circuits. 

Now home & roaring around Eastern Creek again .

spacesailor

Edited July 12, 2023 by spacesailor
Word change by A I

[spenaroo]

On 10/03/2020 at 4:41 PM, skippydiesel said:

Recommended max cornering speeds that are so inconsistent as to be laughable/dangerous.

the yellow speed sign's....
the motorcyclist challenge is to try and get through the corner at double it.

[old man emu]

Advisory speeds on corners tell the average driver the maximum speed that a vehicle can travel around the curve and in doing so be subjected to a centripetal force of between 0.25 and 0.30g ( 2.45 m/s/s to 2.9 m/s/s). That level of lateral acceleration will result in a "comfortable" rotation around the centre of the curve. It is not the "edge of the envelope" speed at which the corner can be taken.

 

The first thing that will determine that speed is the composition of the vehicle's tyres. The composition of the tyre determines the amount of friction that can be developed between the tyre and the road surface - the amount of grip. Your stock standard tyre for a passenger car has a different composition than the tyre for a 4WD, a truck or a motorcycle. Since the road designer doesn't know the exact mix of vehicles that will use the road, it is usual to rely on passenger car tyres. I suppose the idea is that average passenger car drivers have the least knowledge of the handling characteristics of their vehicles, so the designers work the lowest common denominator.

 

The next thing is the camber of the road itself. Race tracks and railway lines have camber, or banking, on their corners to facilitate higher speeds around curves than would be possible on a flat surface. Our public roads have camber in order to allow rainwater to drain off them. This means that these roads have an upturned U-shape with the highest point being along the centreline. If a vehicle travels around a right hand curve, then the angle of the camber reduces the amount of friction and hence centripetal force, that the tyres can generate. Conversely, in a left hand curve, the angle of the camber assists in increasing the friction. Therefore you can take the same corner faster one way than the other. That's why cars tend to go off the left hand side of the road in right hand corners.

 

Also involved in the speed determination is the height of the Centre of Gravity of the vehicle, and its location in relation to the lateral and longitudinal dimensions of the vehicle. It was the height of the C of G of the bus in the Hunter Valley that would have contributed to its rolling over. Also, I'd bet the the roundabout had a negative camber. Include the "grip" of heavy vehicle tyres and the speed, and all the holes in the block of cheese line up.

[Old Koreelah]

11 hours ago, spenaroo said:

the yellow speed sign's....
the motorcyclist challenge is to try and get through the corner at double it.

When we were young and indestructible, the standard approach speed was to read Km/h as mph.

[onetrack]

When roads are properly constructed, the road camber should change to a flat profile with an elevated outside edge, at the commencement point of the curve - to facilitate proper vehicle cornering - the same as railways have elevated outside rails on curves to provide the equivalent of a banked turn in an aircraft. 

Unfortunately, Australia has a vast number of badly engineered road curves (a lot of times, actually "not engineered" curves), as a result of a lack of supervisory oversight, and reliance on grader operators "eyeing in" the curve without surveying assistance.

Another deadly factor is road curves constructed with a varying radius - once again, because a surveyor wasn't present to peg the proper radius of the curve for the grader operator/s. These "varying radius" curves are often real killers, as they can tighten without warning, and catch out unwary drivers.

 

Below is a link to a local suburban road with one of these badly-constructed curves - Belgravia St., Ascot, W.A., at the T-junction with Frederick St. This curve is an absolute shocker, when heading in a Northerly direction along Belgravia St., you start off heading into a gentle curve, which gets tighter and tighter! I'm amazed that there's not more prangs at this spot, I guess the low speed limit of 60kmh prevents a lot of disasters.

 

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Belgravia+St,+Ascot+WA+6104/@-31.9501164,115.9288081,949

[Marty_d]

When they get them right though - they are the best place to ride a motorbike. 

[pmccarthy]

In Ballarat there used to be a downhill left hand curve onto a bridge. The bridge could get ice on it. Enough said.

[facthunter]

Lots of places in Ballarat get ice on them.  You'd freeze the walls off a bark humpy there. Wooden planked bridges are the worst for ice when on a motorbike as is a wet roundabout with diesel spill on it. Nev

[onetrack]

Ballarat makes Canberra look like a tropical oasis. I don't know why Ballarat is that way, is it something to do with the location being in an Antarctic-facing valley?

[old man emu]

12 hours ago, onetrack said:

Belgravia St., Ascot, W.A., at the T-junction with Frederick St.

Looks like that is part of the route between the north side of the Swan River and Leach Highway.

 

I was following Route 55 northwards and discovered at fantastic site for the bloke who owns the Fyre restaurant to build a new restaurant. Have a look at the western corner of the intersection of Guildford and Garratt Roads, across the road from Bayswater Mazda. 

[Old Koreelah]

12 hours ago, onetrack said:

Another deadly factor is road curves constructed with a varying radius - once again, because a surveyor wasn't present to peg the proper radius of the curve for the grader operator/s. These "varying radius" curves are often real killers, as they can tighten without warning, and catch out unwary drivers.

- and motorcyclists! There is a bad one east of Tenterfield on the Bruxner Highway, which caused me a near-death experience in 1971. My first time riding that road, I entered this downhill RH curve at speed, but it got progressively tighter.
My crappy old Triumph Thunderbird scraped its solid footpeg but hung on, probably because the hot tar was so sticky.

[facthunter]

The "Thunderbolt Way" from Gloucester to Walcha and then to Wauchope is a good one for bends  and a few that tighten up on  you.  Nev

[facthunter]

The SW parts of Tassie are like Ballarat Goulburn etc I think Canberra has lower recorded temps than either but not recently. Altitude and Latitude and exposure I would think.   I've flow through heavy snowfalls near Kinglake coming into Melbourne  and it certainly is impressive with the landing lights on... Nev

[Bruce Tuncks]

Some kids I knew rolled their Rav 4 turning right when the camber of the road was against them. If I had my way, in order to get a license, you would need to do calculations involving c of g height, centrifugal force, reaction times etc. People posting here would easily pass, the main idea is to make sure that you withheld a license from a complete idiot.

[facthunter]

Well, they've dismally failed in that worthy aim.. Modern cars isolate you from the reality of the danger the speed you are doing creates. A Coupla nights with the ambo's would fix that, or be first at a bad crash scene by yourself.  Stuff of nightmares.  Nev

[spenaroo]

6 hours ago, facthunter said:

Well, they've dismally failed in that worthy aim.. Modern cars isolate you from the reality of the danger the speed you are doing creates. A Coupla nights with the ambo's would fix that, or be first at a bad crash scene by yourself.  Stuff of nightmares.  Nev

Jump on a motorcycle, it certainly helps with road craft and building that sixth sense of knowing instinctively trouble is ahead or watch for certain vehicles. 

what we need is also to get an idea of trucks and their limitations in maneuvering and braking.
way to many people treat them like another car

[facthunter]

Some truck drivers do indeed, but many car drivers cut them off without a thought for how the truck has to react. In Sydney there seem s to be more trucks that just pull out to overtake WHEN you are halfway past them in another lane. I used to get cranky but now I just hit the stoppers and get back behind..  Nev