Atheist knowledge

[Litespeed]

Whilst I agree some bikies can be classed as just nice blokes that is increasingly the rarity. They have now moved into Thailand and Indonesia big time as criminal gangs.

 

Any group that demands loyalty through violence is a big worry. The shooting murder at Picton last week was a case in point. One bloke wanted to leave the "Hells Angels" and was meeting to discuss conditions of his leaving. Which could include large sums of money, handing over his bikes and cutting out his tatts amongst other things. He freaked and shot the "negotiator" and then took his own life, as he saw that as the only way out.

 

These blokes are just Mafia on bikes, but without any real code of honor.

 

 

[facthunter]

Yeah let's tar them all with the one brush. Nothing's changed as I said before. I suppose if you drive a Toyota ute you are a member of Isis. Probably more murderers drive luxury cars, than motor bikes. Marlon Brando started this, with the film "The Wild One". Sure get the bad guys, don't tarnish the rest The TOY runs they do every year get written up in the papers ? Probably not doesn't sell papers ..Nev

 

 

[Litespeed]

I did say they are not all like that, but that tends to be the exception- the money involved is huge.

 

I have friends who were involved with some of the patch clubs and quickly learnt, it was not all sweet roses. They left before they reached the point of no return.

 

The toy runs are great, I have done many and will again.

 

Do not confuse a biker with a bikie. I ride and thus a biker.

 

 

[facthunter]

Most lump them together. I have spannered bikes for some Hell's Angels members individually and got paid on time always. No probs no pressure to get involved. When you join those organisations you should know what you are getting in to. You would have to NAIVE in the extreme if you didn't. Drugs I hate, But I would make them legal and rehab required if any offence(s) involved. That would wreck their business model We pay the highest price for ice anywhere in the world. Nev

 

 

[Litespeed]

FT

 

I agree drugs should be legalised and regulated, taxed and the taxes go to rehab programs.

 

The war on drugs is just a war on people and a great way to fill jails, employ cops and make lots of money for lawyers and criminals.

 

The big music festivals are just a tragedy- people die because they can not test what they have for safety. Testing is common in europe and lives are saved, it also reduces the amount of poisoned drugs out there. The use of dogs by police at festivals means peeps swallow everything before entry and put themselves at great risk.

 

 

[Litespeed]

And I should add, often the cops love the festivals and footy matches as they are done on cost recovery basis.

 

The cops insist they must have x police for a event and make the venue pay- which is a joke. Since when did the policing of NSW require the public to pay extra for policing. A great rort and loved by a friend who is a cop- always big pay as it is overtime rates.

 

 

[Yenn]

Reading this I see that there is little difference between bikies and muslims. The Qld government says bikies are criminals because of the crimes committed by a very small proportion of bikies. So why are muslims not all criminals beceause of the crimes of a few. Maybe it is because the bikie crims do not make a big deal about being bikies. Seems ridiculous to me.

 

 

[facthunter]

You can get the easily led to vote for you if you appear strong against crime. Works every election. The VLAD laws probably wouldn't hold up in a court reliably. Shown to bring about the most stupid of consequences many times. There ARE issues to be dealt with though . The proper way. Nev

 

 

[Marty_d]

Reading this I see that there is little difference between bikies and muslims. The Qld government says bikies are criminals because of the crimes committed by a very small proportion of bikies. So why are muslims not all criminals beceause of the crimes of a few. Maybe it is because the bikie crims do not make a big deal about being bikies. Seems ridiculous to me.

The conclusion I would draw is that the previous QLD government were morons.

 

 

[cscotthendry]

The conclusion I would draw is that the previous QLD government were morons.

Worse yet, Campbell Newman was a martinet.

 

 

[Yenn]

In that case he should never have left Martinique.

 

Seriously though the LNP were never going to win an election with the collection of ex leaders they had and still have. Lauren Springborg still doesn't come up as good as the premier, who's name I cannot spell.

 

 

[DonRamsay]

. . .You are free to be a member of the CPC or not. If not you can't vote . . .

Sorry to be so late to this party but . . .

 

I'm impressed with the democracy of the CPC. However, just one small detail seems to undo the theory that China is a "real" democracy.

 

Of the 1,300,000,000 members of Chinese society, approximately 1,260,000,000 are *not* members of the CPC.

 

Makes the claim of government of the people by the people more like you can fool some of the people all the time.

 

 

[DonRamsay]

Voting is compulsory, but you don't have to vote. you have to get your name ticke off. my son tells me that he once put his voting paper straight into the ballot box and the returning officer told him he could'nt do that. But he just did.

Some non voters get creative and draw cock and balls on their ballot paper giving bored scrutineers something to chuckle about.

 

 

[DonRamsay]

. . . The Westminster style of democracy, as we have it in Australia, is pretty much the best version of democracy available because its basis is a constitutional monarchy. . . .

Democracy in Australia works moderately well despite the fact that it is fundamentally a theocratic autocracy. The ultimate authority in Australia is the crown and head of the Church of England. This is actually the single worst thing about our democracy. Being based on a heridtary feudal system, we are all the modern day equivalents of serfs and vassals.

 

This awful system is manifested in our society by having zero freedoms other than those granted to us by licence from the crown. All crimes are crimes not against our fellow man but an offense to the Crown.

 

Organisations like CASA get their power from the Crown and grant licences. Consider the USA where your qualification is recognised as such not just the benificence of the Monarch or their representative. Your training is recognised with a certificate not a licence.

 

The monarchist system is the very reason why CASA acts like a despot. They grant licences and bestow favours or privileges. They want *us* to make the case that we should have a safer passage up the coast when it should be their job to show us the logic of restricting our access to CTA. They should have to justify their restrictions on our freedoms not us go begging on a blended knee for a privilege.

 

Viva la revolution . . . Liberte Fraternite Equalite.

 

Off with their heads and the sooner we can cease being vassals if the crown the sooner we can stand tall as free men and women . . .

 

I may have just got a bit carried away.

 

I think I need a lie down now.

 

 

[hihosland]

Don did say

 

"Democracy in Australia works moderately well despite the fact that it is fundamentally a theocratic autocracy."

 

and

 

"I think I need a lie down now."

 

rather a contradiction that democracy/autocracy notion

 

I wonder if the lie down will be in the company of a member of the demos or of the theos

 

or perhaps a quiet autocratic lie down is the preferred option

 

 

[DonRamsay]

. . . rather a contradiction that democracy/autocracy notion . . .

We've papered over the theocratic bit with a thick veneer of democracy but even if theocracy is well buried, the autocracy bit lingers on in every government instrumentality. Democracy in Australia would work better with a Bill of Rights that guaranteed our fundamental freeman status.

 

 

[hihosland]

A bill of rights defines and restricts the definition of rights and fails to address situations and attitudes as they change over time.

 

 

 

Our common law administered by judges independant of the government already address basic rights and when there is confusion or ambiguity in the Australian law have access to the statutes and principles of international jurisprudence as they relate to human rights. The Marbo case a classic example

 

 

 

If there was a statute of rights established by the Parlament of Australia the judges would not have this ability nor flexibility to oversight the evolution of Australian laws.

 

 

 

The only flaw in our constitutional monarchy is the potential for the Queen to resign as Queen of Australia and we would be stuck with Charlie.

 

Unfortunately were are storming down the road of a politicised elected president. Already if you ask a random selection of voters who did they vote for the answer, if you get one, would be the name of the leader of their preferred party, not the name of their local representative as envisaged by the drafters of the constitution.

 

 

[Litespeed]

Hihosland,

 

I disagree,

 

A well written bill of rights would enshrine our basic freedoms, currently we are at the mercy of whatever the despots in canberra think is a good idea or they can get away with.

 

A lot of the current terrorism laws would not stand up against a bill of rights. Nor would the way corporate interests run rough shod over the rights of humans. Nor mandatory detention in NT and a number of others.

 

At the moment if the courts say something is wrong- all Canberra has to do is make legislation and goodbye our rights. WE also have a situation through case law that the courts interpret the meaning of the Constitution and laws by precendent or the judges own bias. Basically governments get to do whatever they want. They use technicalities to do what they want rather than the nature and intent of the law.

 

You only have to look at immigration as a example.

 

Native title is a very poor example- over twenty years later people are still getting screwed and the lot of Aborigines has not been greatly improved.

 

If the Original Australians were a corporation they would have been massively compensated and rule the joint.

 

When it comes to human rights- international law means nothing- the government can do what the hell it likes and always does.

 

We have no protections granted by being a monarchy, as we can no longer appeal to the Privy council in England. All we still have is the ability for a democratically elected government to be booted out by the GG. As per Gough Whitlam and 1975. People say it could never happen again- but it could and no changes have been made to stop it.

 

In fact the despot Kerr was meant to consult the Queen and only advise on such a decision- but alas did what he wanted and damn the law.

 

 

[bexrbetter]

Sorry to be so late to this party but . . .

I'm impressed with the democracy of the CPC. However, just one small detail seems to undo the theory that China is a "real" democracy.

 

Of the 1,300,000,000 members of Chinese society, approximately 1,260,000,000 are *not* members of the CPC.

 

Makes the claim of government of the people by the people more like you can fool some of the people all the time.

 

China's 85+ million CPC Members of 1300 million is 6.5%

 

Vs

 

Australia's 140000+ Oz Party members of 24 million = 0.65%

 

6.5% Vs 0.65%, so according to your context, China must be 10 times more democratic than Australia.

 

By rights, based on Membership, the Melbourne Cricket Club should be running Australia.

 

No claims here, I was asked how it works and I offered the info.

 

 

[Bruce]

Well Don , your side and mine too lost the referendum on the monarchy. But there were no hard-hitting arguments such as the ones you just presented in the pro-republican campaign run by Turnbull. All the hard-hitting arguments came from the monarchist side.

 

I thought at the time Turnbull was trying to lose , and to this day I wonder. Was he not appointed by the monarchist Howard?

 

But alas I don't think we would be seeing much different with CASA even if the republic had won out.

 

 

[Yenn]

I was for a republic when the election was going on, but Turnbull took it over and convinced me that the monarchy was a better option.

 

It would be nice to be a republic, but I hope it doesn't happen because it would be a half cocked stuff up. I would rather King Charles, the some jumped up politician any time.

 

Just think we could have John Howard as president or even Joe Hockey. About the only pollie who would stand even a tiny chance of doing a good job would be Paul Keating. Don't laugh, he was better than he was ever given credit for and far, far better than "Little John" or R Slicker as Clarke and Dawe portrayed him.

 

 

[Marty_d]

China's 85+ million CPC Members of 1300 million is 6.5%

Vs

 

Australia's 140000+ Oz Party members of 24 million = 0.65%

 

6.5% Vs 0.65%, so according to your context, China must be 10 times more democratic than Australia.

 

By rights, based on Membership, the Melbourne Cricket Club should be running Australia.

 

No claims here, I was asked how it works and I offered the info.

Not arguing with your figures, but I think Don's point is that only CPC members are allowed to vote, and they only form 6.5% of the population.

 

100% of Australian citizens (not party members) over 18 are not only allowed but required to vote.

 

 

[facthunter]

Someone who rules your country by birthright? Even though it seems benign it's not a good look in the modern world .The Poms are used to a class system and still have unelected people in the House of Lords.

 

Equality of opportunity is what I want as a basis of the ethics of government. That's NOT equality of money but whatever little kid you see should have the same chance at succeeding, as the next one. Betty Windsor hasn't done a bad job but the Poms make money from the tourists. Charlie seems like a well intentioned bloke too. Brit's don't care about here. The performance at Singapore was outrageously bad in WW2 .When they joined the EU they dropped all the trade arrangements with us to be part of the EU trade cartel. Stay in the commonwealth. Others do. Unless it becomes useless..

 

With a republic you have to clearly define the powers of the Prime Minister AND the President,( if you use that term) and have NO confusion. We lost access to the right to appeal to the Privy Council years ago so we do need an appropriate Bill of Rights. Nev

 

 

[bexrbetter]

Not arguing with your figures, but I think Don's point is that only CPC members are allowed to vote, and they only form 6.5% of the population.

Yeah, well it doesn't work like that, but believe what you want. I only bother trying to explain because I'm tired of reading the crap every day (media reports I am referring too) and would prefer countries and races were just a bit friendlier to each other or at least mind their own business - and from their own sides of the fence.

 

Which includes Australia btw, what the hell is an Orion doing here? A "routine maritime patrol" in the Northern Hemisphere, yeah right, is there no concern about Australia doing what America beckons it to do and putting us at risk?

 

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-35099445

 

100% of Australian citizens (not party members) over 18 are not only allowed but required to vote.

Not "required", forced under threat of lawful action to vote which is not democratic and also debatable if it's the right thing.

 

While we continue to force people to vote for the second best choice, then we will always have second best.

 

 

[turboplanner]

Which includes Australia btw, what the hell is an Orion doing here? A "routine maritime patrol" in the Northern Hemisphere, yeah right, is there no concern about Australia doing what America beckons it to do and putting us at risk?

My cousin's son was pushing the throttles on that one. Don't tell anyone but they go up there once a week to get the best take away noodles in all of Asia!