DonRamsay Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 Oh Dear . . . clear evidence that the only way to defeat fundamental ignorance is education. But, in many cases, re-education is impossible so deeply imbedded is the bullshit. Very sad that they'll pass all this on to the next generation. Only way to defeat islamic fundamentalism is to starve it of money by driving electric cars and watch the price of oil drop to near zero.
kasper Posted February 20, 2015 Posted February 20, 2015 Oh Dear . . . clear evidence that the only way to defeat fundamental ignorance is education. But, in many cases, re-education is impossible so deeply imbedded is the ********. Very sad that they'll pass all this on to the next generation. Only way to defeat islamic fundamentalism is to starve it of money by driving electric cars and watch the price of oil drop to near zero. But that's the - excuse the pun - fundamental issue -> a belief based on faith is irreconcilable to education based on evidence or theory ... basic issue is that faith wins because it ignores anything that is in conflict with it.
Old Koreelah Posted February 20, 2015 Posted February 20, 2015 But that's the - excuse the pun - fundamental issue -> a belief based on faith is irreconcilable to education based on evidence or theory ... basic issue is that faith wins because it ignores anything that is in conflict with it. If you're worried about the thousands of ignorant young men flocking to the jihadist flag, you ain't seen nothin' yet: many Islamic countries lack a decent public education system. While our government cuts back foreign aid to poor neighbours, cashed-up Arabs are throwing money at schools which spread the fundamentalist message. We might soon wish we had invested a little in their public schools. What's the best value for our defence dollar? Billions to purchase America's latest jet, or a few million to prop up public education in nearby Islamic countries?
turboplanner Posted February 20, 2015 Posted February 20, 2015 OK The nearby countries are not the ones beheading innocent people.
dazza 38 Posted February 20, 2015 Posted February 20, 2015 If you're worried about the thousands of ignorant young men flocking to the jihadist flag, you ain't seen nothin' yet: many Islamic countries lack a decent public education system. While our government cuts back foreign aid to poor neighbours, cashed-up Arabs are throwing money at schools which spread the fundamentalist message. We might soon wish we had invested a little in their public schools. What's the best value for our defence dollar? Billions to purchase America's latest jet, or a few million to prop up public education in nearby Islamic countries? We give them millions on foreign aid and the money ends being use on the military. Dont't give them one more cent.
facthunter Posted February 20, 2015 Posted February 20, 2015 I recollect they gave money to QLD on the last Cyclone. It's a lot harder for them to find than for us and they are a very recent democracy with a lot of work to do after 100s of years of Colonial rule.. We have bigger houses now than America. Lets have even bigger ones and more War Tanks in the garage to show our success. That seems like a worthwhile aim ?? Nev
Old Koreelah Posted February 20, 2015 Posted February 20, 2015 We give them millions on foreign aid and the money ends being use on the military. Dont't give them one more cent. Maybe true Dazza, but a few bob spent on their schools might keep impressionable young fellas out of the clutches of evil jihad masters. Good value for money.
Old Koreelah Posted February 20, 2015 Posted February 20, 2015 OK The nearby countries are not the ones beheading innocent people. Not yet.
turboplanner Posted February 20, 2015 Posted February 20, 2015 If you're worried about the thousands of ignorant young men flocking to the jihadist flag, you ain't seen nothin' yet: many Islamic countries lack a decent public education system. While our government cuts back foreign aid to poor neighbours, cashed-up Arabs are throwing money at schools which spread the fundamentalist message. We might soon wish we had invested a little in their public schools. What's the best value for our defence dollar? Billions to purchase America's latest jet, or a few million to prop up public education in nearby Islamic countries? You're too late OK, they've already attacked us with Ice Cream Carts (see photo - Source:Wikipedia) So where would we be investing? Well we should start at home, since Australia has 476,291 Muslims (2011 Census) And we should be organising a spear buyback as well as extra lessons because there are 1,140 Aboriginal Muslims (2011 Census) Malaysia, with whom we work in a mutual defence arrangement, has 17,139,000 Muslims; I stood in a crowd of over 10,000 of them at their children's University graduations in December, and I wouldn't be the one to hand out pamphlets telling them how to improve their already friendly behaviour. Indonesia has 204, 847,018 - you can see that each of the 25 million Australian would have to contact 8 Indonesians to get the message. Then there's this batch of friendly countries: Austria 475,000 Belgium 638,000 Canada 940,000 Bulgaria 1,002,000 Argentina 1,600,000 Bosnia-Herzegovina 1,564,000 France 4,704,000 Philippines 4,737,000 Azerbaijan 8,795,000 Bangladesh 148,607,000 or China 23,308,000 I'd suggest FA18s are cheaper than school teachers. I looking at these countries, it's clear to me that the Muslims in these countries lead a peaceful life, and the ones I mix with, including a favourite dinner group have no problem in isolating the beheadings and murder to a very small group of people who need to face the full weight of the laws of the countries they operate from. [ATTACH]47549._xfImport[/ATTACH]
bexrbetter Posted February 20, 2015 Posted February 20, 2015 China 23,308,000 I looking at these countries, it's clear to me that the Muslims in these countries lead a peaceful life, Absolute ballshite. You just don't know about the constant murders and terror attacks and the civil unrest, etc, likely the highest outside of the Middle East, because it's not a good fit with the Western Press to report "Big Bad Commo China" actually suffering. You only hear about stuff like the train station attacks because that's impossible to ignore ... http://cn.bing.com/search?q=China+Train+station+attacks&go=Submit&qs=n&form=QBRE&pq=china+train+station+attacks&sc=0-25&sp=-1&sk=&cvid=7beb9adff80d424cac966313842e5ef6
facthunter Posted February 20, 2015 Posted February 20, 2015 The western provinces "Uigur" areas are very tense. That matter isn't a simple" goodies and baddies " either as a lot of it is represented as. You won't learn much from the Main Stream Media. Nev
Old Koreelah Posted February 20, 2015 Posted February 20, 2015 You're too late OK, they've already attacked us with Ice Cream Carts (see photo - Source:Wikipedia).... All very interesting Turbs, but you seem to have missed my point: that breeding grounds for ignorance are being funded all across the Islamic world in the vacuum left by lack of funding for secular education
turboplanner Posted February 20, 2015 Posted February 20, 2015 No I didn't miss your point, I just provided SOME of the volume you have to cost for - you must be one of those rich RA pilots they go on about on prune.
dazza 38 Posted February 20, 2015 Posted February 20, 2015 I will say this, the longer ISIS gets stronger in the ME,the longer they feel that they will win. That isn't going to happen, they will be eradicated sooner or later. The western world will sooner or later, bomb them into submission.
Old Koreelah Posted February 20, 2015 Posted February 20, 2015 No I didn't miss your point, I just provided SOME of the volume you have to cost for - you must be one of those rich RA pilots they go on about on prune. Sorry Turbs, the water is getting murky. My point is that we might get very good value for our defence/public security dollar if we (and other rich countries) supported secular education where there is a demonstrable risk of crazies spreading their hate message.
Marty_d Posted February 20, 2015 Posted February 20, 2015 We can't let this descend into a clash of civilizations. Several different approaches are needed. Yes missiles and bullets against daesh or ISIS or whatever the hell they call themselves. Yes police trained to put a quick bullet in the heads of hostage takers. But more importantly - work to stop the funding of these organisations; help build proper education systems; work with the broader communities to stop the radicalization of youth. There's probably a hundred other things that need to happen too. It's not simple, it's not easy, and there's no silver bullet.
Old Koreelah Posted February 20, 2015 Posted February 20, 2015 I will say this, the longer ISIS gets stronger in the ME,the longer they feel that they will win. That isn't going to happen, they will be eradicated sooner or later.The western world will sooner or later, bomb them into submission. Crickey Dazza! That's exactly the sort of rhetoric those evil, ignorant bastards are using. That's how they WANT us to react to their atrocities, to trigger an interfaith war so they can claim the leadership of their side. Let's hope our response will be based on patience, logic and decency. Unfortunately I'm not so sure the west would beat them. History has shown that determined fighters willing to sacrifice plenty of civilian blood will usually win out because the west and the Americans in particular have a short concentration span.
bexrbetter Posted February 20, 2015 Posted February 20, 2015 Look, I'm not saying Jesus was racist, but finding guys with the names Peter, John, James, Mathew, Andrew, Luke and Simon in the Middle East? C'mon ......
turboplanner Posted February 20, 2015 Posted February 20, 2015 Sorry Turbs, the water is getting murky. My point is that we might get very good value for our defence/public security dollar if we (and other rich countries) supported secular education where there is a demonstrable risk if crazies spreading their hate message. And that would cost us GAZILLIONS, and you aren't getting my tax to spend on them.
Bikky Posted February 20, 2015 Posted February 20, 2015 Sure it would cost a heap, but ... how much does it currently cost to keep troops in Afghanistan? Imagine having to send more to other potential trouble-spots in the ME. I don't think brute force would do the job. We're not looking at identifiable targets here. Turning the local population against these ratbags by showing the west isn't all bad may be a more desirable goal. Look at it as an investment.
Old Koreelah Posted February 20, 2015 Posted February 20, 2015 And that would cost us GAZILLIONS... It may prove cheaper than billion-dollar fighter planes. We're not talking about subsidising the entire Islamic world's schools- just those in the poorest areas that are targeted by Jihadists. ...and you aren't getting my tax to spend on them. Perhaps you should apply some reason and Christian decency to that statement.
facthunter Posted February 21, 2015 Posted February 21, 2015 The reality is gazillions of $'s come from Saudia to fund madrassa's where their brand of Islam is promoted. You will never match it.. Left alone these people will fight each other, but by making the great Satan of the west (it's not hard to do) they recruit the brain washed and vulnerable unemployed youth to their cause which will be an Islamic Theocracy. A TOTALITARIAN form of government. The Leaders of the ME won't be able to control them either as most of them haven't done the right thing by their own people. ISIS aim to convert or exterminate the whole world. Nothing is more clear. They have been making their aims obvious for 10 or more years. Nev
Marty_d Posted February 21, 2015 Posted February 21, 2015 The reality is gazillions of $'s come from Saudia to fund madrassa's where their brand of Islam is promoted. You will never match it.. Left alone these people will fight each other, but by making the great Satan of the west (it's not hard to do) they recruit the brain washed and vulnerable unemployed youth to their cause which will be an Islamic Theocracy. A TOTALITARIAN form of government. The Leaders of the ME won't be able to control them either as most of them haven't done the right thing by their own people. ISIS aim to convert or exterminate the whole world. Nothing is more clear. They have been making their aims obvious for 10 or more years. Nev Which brings us back to the point that someone else made. Get rid of our dependence on oil and the Saudi's wealth evaporates. Even climate change deniers should see the benefits of this one...
coljones Posted February 21, 2015 Posted February 21, 2015 While I have been a long term supporter of the Libs and continue to be for their sound economic management approach, the insistence by Tony Abbott of religious ministers and banning ethics teachers was the final straw. Now I can't wait for him to be gone. Last thing we need in Australia is politicians using their position to try and turn Australia into a theocracy. And Abbott added insult to injury by de-funding secular welfare workers in schools but increased funding for chaplains - whose only qualification was to be anointed by religious organisations. By the way Peter Garrett - I think you are a complete tosser.
coljones Posted February 21, 2015 Posted February 21, 2015 Oh Dear . . . clear evidence that the only way to defeat fundamental ignorance is education. But, in many cases, re-education is impossible so deeply imbedded is the ********. Very sad that they'll pass all this on to the next generation. Only way to defeat islamic fundamentalism is to starve it of money by driving electric cars and watch the price of oil drop to near zero. Or walking or riding a push bike on short journeys (or even on longer ones) - support your local RailTrail. That will fix our over dependence on foreign oil, reduce the number of chronic disease sufferers in hospital and drive the oil barons in US and Middle East crazy.
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