Australia abandons our allies to the evil Taliban

[Old Koreelah]

One of the historic moments that made me proud to be Australian was when Malcolm Fraser ordered our navy to rescue thousands of boat people fleeing Vietnam.

 

Decades later, a much more vicious enemy and a totally different Prime Minister.

Afghans who helped our troops are in grave fear of their lives and what is our government doing to help them? Dragging its feet while the Taliban torture and behead anyone who helped westerners. These evil bastards have also ordered that all girls over 15 have to marry Taliban fighters. 

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-07-16/taliban-militants-afghanistan-civilian-torture/100300730

 

Quite apart from the human decency angle- if we don’t save these people the world will miss out on their drive and potential.

Australia has benefitted from so many talented people who made it to our shores. The Afghan people who helped our forces are a future talent pool for this country.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2021/jul/20/afghan-war-veteran-burns-service-medal-saying-morrison-government-betraying-anzac-spirit

 

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/jul/19/life-or-death-for-hazaras-australia-has-a-moral-obligation-to-act-now

 

 

[spacesailor]

I AGREE ,.

Bring our ALLIES HOME,!.

Even if It is a new home & a new life here in Australia.

Someone should start ( very quickly ) a petition to get them into a SAFE place.

spacesailor

Edited July 31, 2021 by spacesailor
Spelling

[Jerry_Atrick]

Yes.. Such actions are reprehensible.

 

The UK is "slightly" xenophobic when it comes to immigrants - even the descendants of those who settled previously - such as the "Windrush" generation and some Ghurkas. However, even the current Home Secretary, Priti Patel who is ironically anti-immigration has allowed the Afghans to re-settle: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-57301065

 

Also, this is a good way to turn people with an affinity to us against us in a region where radicalisation is easy... Failure to act and bring them home could come home to roost in a much worse way.

[willedoo]

Time is running out. This is the opening quote from yesterday's security alert from the U.S. embassy in Kabul:

 

'Location: Throughout Afghanistan

The U.S. Embassy urges U.S. citizens to leave Afghanistan immediately using available commercial flight options.  Given the security conditions and reduced staffing, the Embassy’s ability to assist U.S. citizens in Afghanistan is extremely limited even within Kabul.'

 

https://af.usembassy.gov/security-alert-u-s-embassy-kabul-afghanistan-august-7-2021/

Edited August 9, 2021 by willedoo

[red750]

I see on Yahoo News that the Taliban are reported to have shot a woman dead outside her house for wearing tight clothing and not being accompanied by a male member of her family, both against strict Taliban rules.

[onetrack]

Probably just one of many - it was the only one actually reported. I don't understand how these rock-apes keep up such levels of power over the nation, apart from the constant wielding of absolutely brutality, that makes the Gestapo look positively kind.

[Yenn]

How they keep power is by brute force and that has been enabled by the way we and the yanks went into their country AND DEMOLISHED ANY FORM OF SANE GOVERNMENT.

[Jerry_Atrick]

How does one agree and express sadness with forum emojis at the same time?

[nomadpete]

It's embarrassing to know that our chosen (elected) representatives have such a lack of empathy and ethics.

 

We have double crossed our allies. In that context, I'm referring to our interpreters, etc, whom we promised sanctuary to, then left behind.

[spacesailor]

nomad p

I totally agree,

AND if someone hears there is a petition ( that list of names  ),

please let me know, i want my name there too !.

It was the same at Dunkirk. The English left ALL the Volunteer Rail Way men, behind!.

Too be executed by the Germans.

spacesailor

[Old Koreelah]

52 minutes ago, spacesailor said:

nomad p

I totally agree,

AND if someone hears there is a petition ( that list of names  ),

https://www.change.org/p/minister-for-home-affairs-bring-our-vulnerable-afghan-families-to-australia

[Marty_d]

Thanks, OK.  Signed.

[willedoo]

The Taliban have claimed complete control in Kandahar, the second largest city. There's reports that government forces still control the airport, but I would think that would only be until remaining troops can be evacuated. Some intelligence reports are saying the Taliban could enter Kabul within weeks.

[spacesailor]

Done

Signed willingly! .

spacesailor

[Jerry_Atrick]

Looks like there will be no need (or reduced need): https://www.theage.com.au/politics/federal/australia-to-rescue-afghan-workers-in-international-emergency-evacuation-20210813-p58ij1.html

 

Despite them saying it had been in the planning for months, I am more inclined to believe that the close discussions, particularly with the US, may have led a change in heart.

 

Sadly, the world is abandoning Afghanistan... Was there no oil?

[Marty_d]

Every bugger has had a crack at Afghanistan, and they've all left with their tail between their legs.

[pmccarthy]

Four things greater than all things are, --

Women and Horses and Power and War.

We spake of them all, but the last the most,

For I sought a word of a Russian post,

Of a shifty promise, an unsheathed sword

And a grey-coat guard on the Helmund ford.

 

-       From The Ballad of the King’s Jest, by Rudyard Kipling. 1890.

[Dax]

The interest in Afghanistan believe stems from the fact it's the most strategic place in the nth hemisphere for missile and surveillance sites to reach anywhere on the planet, but that was over a decade ago read that.  They used the excuse to stay there after 9/11 blaming the Taliban for that, but it was the Saudi's who were behind that attack and it seems they are still laying blame for all terrorism as coming from that region. Where as it's probable the middle eastern rich countries that supply terrorists, want to take over the world just as the rest of the muslim elites want to do. All yahweh religious books state that categorically, god nutter world control by any means to satisfy their non existent god of war.

 

As for those who worked with our troops, it's sad for them to be left behind, but do we need more religious nutters in our country. We are already seeing the results of god nutters being in charge of Aus and the planet, muslim cultists demand their insane beliefs and ways of life be introduced here and take precedence over our cultural approach. We are not supposed to offend them or their culture, but they are allowed to offend us by demanding we cater for their cultural and belief insanity and ours take second place.

 

 

[Marty_d]

I question that the brave interpreters who actually risk being killed (and probably their families targeted) for assisting Australian forces could be called "religious nutters".  If you want to get rid of religious nutters in this country then start with child-abusing priests.

 

They are exactly the kind of people we need here - courageous, talented and motivated.  Who they pray to doesn't really matter.

[spacesailor]

Marty_d

I do sincerely agree with you.

Bring them to safety! .

spacesailor

[Jerry_Atrick]

Firstly, it is not the Taliban that is attributed  to the 9/11 attack, but Al Qaeda, of which Osama bin Laden was the leader. Osama is from a wealthy Saudi family, I believe related to the Saudi royal family. All of his family [at least publicly] denounced him, however, no doubt, within the hallows of Saudi leadership/aristorcracy, he had his supporters and was well funded from within. There is an assertion that Saudi's backed the attacks and fudamentalist Saudis joined in... Whether it was governmental or not is still up for debate, but the circumstantial (released or reported) evidence does add up that way. You may be interested in this article: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/23/magazine/9-11-saudi-arabia-fbi.html

 

I don't think anyone is saying there is no Saudi connection.

 

As an aside, members on bin Laden's family died in a bizjet crash at my home airport until about a year ago: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hampshire-39193485

 

The Taliban had been accused of harbouring, aiding (not necessarily financially), protecting, and allowing terrorist regimes to flourish. When Bush wanted to go in to get bin Laden and Al Qaeda; The Taliban didn't allow it and vowed to protect terrorist organisations. So, Bush went OK, we;'re in.

 

Like most things in the ME, it is a complicated affair. However, the average Afghan (or at least in cities) do not support (or even, it is fair to say, hate) the Taliban. They are a brutal regime - in general - as there are many factions. The west went in to get Al Qaeda and restore peace, remove a potential terrorist breeding ground, and then establish a democracy. As usual, they underestimated the effort, in this case thanks to the geography of the region and it dragged out long enough so when Trump, who couldn't give a shit, decided to pull out and pressured his western allies to do the same so he didn't look like an asshole. 

 

Surpirse, surprise, like COVID, you can never get rid of the Taliban, but you can keep it suppressed with defences. Take the defences away, and the religious nutjobs you talk about, are on the offesnive against average mr and mrs joe who just want to live in peace.

 

13 hours ago, Dax said:

As for those who worked with our troops, it's sad for them to be left behind, but do we need more religious nutters in our country.

You have no clue what you are talking about. To get to work for the allies, they had to undergo rigorous screening. The are not religious nutjobs - yes they may have their beliefs - but they are not out there for some old text which seems to have been replaced (although I do agree - almost all derivative texts are violent in many ways - from what I have heard and seen quoted). These people are by and large those who took the opportunity to take employment in a relatively free society - nothing more. There were no suicide bombers or other terrorist acts committed by these people, where there were by one US servviceman who was radicalised; and by members of the Afghan forces. I had two ex marine officers working for be, both of whom led multiple tours in Afghanistan - the stories they told me compared to what was reported were like chalk and cheese.

 

You are right, though... we don't want religious nutters in our countries.. Let's start be deporting ScoMo to some uninhabited island off Western Australia (sorry, OT). But more often than not, the religious nutters are the leaders or devout, in the case of Islamic terrorism, usually connected to the Iman/s. You will find that none of these ex-employees were that. Just like the religious nutters Marty mentions - it is usually those in power in the institutions and fanatical followers - not your every day person.

 

They served us when we needed help. Denying them sanctuary when their lives or liberity is on the line because they worked for us will only show us as betrayers - hate will fester and with the Taliban taking control anf breeding terrorism, well, it will only be a matter of time before one of the survivors then seeks revenge.  It is more of a risk, if you are worried about terrorist acts on home soil, to deny them refuge.

 

The US is bringing them back; the UK is bringing them back; European countries are bringing them back. Australia should, too.

 

BTW, as of last night, the Taliban had cut off all routes to Kabul; the UK were sending forces in to evacuate both diplomatic, nationals and the Afghans.. There was a COBRA meeting last night where there was an expectation that BoJo would announce keeping an eye on things and readying to deploy forces for a military operation. While the defence minister hasn't ruled it out, all that came of it was the need to evacuate everyone faster.

 

It is questionable why Australia got involved in the first place. But Australia did. Australia, with the rest of the west (although we are South East) that participated have betrayed the country. There will be a risk of those that of the remainder of the population who weren't employed by us foreign "powers" but are left to be taken over by the Taliban will want to seek revenge in a terrorist way - Australia, like the rest of the world is now a much more dangerous place.

 

 

Edited August 14, 2021 by Jerry_Atrick

[Yenn]

Latest I heard is that the USA is sending back troops to get out its nationals and also those who helped them. Australia has made vague noises about doing the same, but knowing our politicians they ill not really do any good, just try to make themselves look good.

I used to be in the military, but I cannot understand why any sane person would want to be in our forces and have to put up with being sent to fight with one hand tied behind your back and the media just wanting to get you into court on trumped up charges.

[Jerry_Atrick]

https://www.theage.com.au/politics/federal/mate-don-t-handpass-afghan-australians-say-time-running-out-for-rescue-20210815-p58iuy.html

 

US, UK and Europeans have all sent forces in already to get their people out. There was reports towards the end of the week that Australia was going to ask the UK to assist in evacuating Australian officials and associated Afghans. Let's hope the Taliban keep to their word.

 

Seems SFM's government takes the gold medal for dilly-dallying and procrastination.

[kgwilson]

The fact that the Taliban is the organisation that is taking over is irrelevant. They are Afghanis and everyone else who has been there for the past 20 years is not. The Yanks have spent a Trillion dollars and trained Afghanis who had no commitment to anything they stood for.

 

When I was there in the 1970s they were a proud people and very friendly and had no animosity to anyone. I was welcomed everywhere I went, even  up into the mountains and the poppy fields. Most Afghanis just want their country back. The Taliban may be headed by a few religious nutters who want to turn time back 400 years but many of them are ordinary Muslim Aghanis. 

 

Sure they will have some repressive conservative fundamentalist laws but it is their country & we can not impose our so called democracy on them even after 20 years and a trillion dollars. 

 

The latest news is that the Taliban have entered Kabul and a spokesman has told Al Jazera news that they are setting up a meeting with the existing government for a peaceful transfer of power. All the while US helicopters are ferrying people out. Shades of Saigon 1975 absolutely. They got rid of the British, the Russians and now finally the Yanks and their lackeys which includes us. 

 

Since 2001 there have been about 3500 coalition deaths but there have been about 64,100 deaths of the Afghan military and 111,000 civilian deaths. To Afghanis the Taliban is not the enemy WE are.

Edited August 15, 2021 by kgwilson

[pmccarthy]

After the Germans were defeated the French executed many collaborators and shaved the heads of women who had consorted. We should not be surprised if something similar happens.