There isno god/s

[nomadpete]

At least pastafarians can claim there is some evidence to support their story.

 

Last Sunday I found a collander and several packs of spaghetti in our kitchen. 

 

The lord (or lordette) works in mysterious ways.

Edited January 8, 2022 by nomadpete

[onetrack]

I've got knitted brows from trying to unravel this Pastafarian religion.

[willedoo]

8 minutes ago, onetrack said:

I've got knitted brows from trying to unravel this Pastafarian religion.

Well at least today is Bubble Bath day on the Pastafarian holy day calendar, so you can relax, take a bath, and forget all about knitting.

[nomadpete]

It was abstinance from knitting, that caused the problem.

 

I've never warmed to abstinance of any kind.

 

I'm not due for my bath until later in the year (weather permitting).

[old man emu]

5 hours ago, facthunter said:

Such a decree is hard on close knit families.  Nev

That comment was plainly a pearl!

[nomadpete]

Is it all a matter of perspective?

 

 

[Bruce Tuncks]

We ( wife and me ) actually helped start an Anglican school. The local state school was so bad that the good teachers were giving up. Political correctness meant that the thug kids were running the average class. 

We would have preferred  a non-religious school of course but that simply would not have happened. Anyway, the kids suffered not at all from the religion stuff. Maybe it made them a bit more cynical than their years deserved. They sure noticed the gap between religious words and the actions on the part of school authorities.

[ClintonB]

I don’t go to church with any regularity, funerals and such only. I have sent my 5 kids to a Christian school, due to the school having staff who care, teach the children to respect rules-uniforms, no phones, no fraternising of any kind, and especially like the way they don’t give awards for every little thing. They ask the students to do their best  at every opportunity rather than saying you don’t conform to this set level.

they have a good handle on what goes on in their school. 
The kids are given conflicting info in science from religious classes, but are allowed to make up their own minds, rather than being spoon fed their way is the only way.

we have not been treated any different than the families who attend their church, which we appreciate.

 

 

 

 

[old man emu]

1 minute ago, ClintonB said:

The kids are given conflicting info in science from religious classes,

I was lucky when I was in school. I had a very intelligent Science Master who, although being a Christian Brother, never stayed from the secular path when dealing with a topic. He expected us to know what was in the State curriculum. However, at the conclusion of a lesson in which he introduced us to old and new facts as required, he never failed to ask, "Isn't God wonderful?" I guess in his mind there is a time and place for everything, and getting a mob of pimply-faced boys through the HSC in science was not the time for religious studies. That was for another period during the day which was tacked on to the normal number of daily school hours.

[kgwilson]

If there are 4000 gods then everyone who believes in only one of them is an athiest who denies all gods but their one but then they will say I am not an athiest because I believe in my god. I can't prove my god exists and I can't prove the other 3999 don't exist. There is no logic to a belief in a god other than it gives comfort to the believer because he/she cannot accept everything evolved and their human brain is unable to accept things they will never know or understand. This is why man invented gods which evolved into religious beliefs. This has nothing to do with the belief in the principles of many religions that are often quite noble. Something like the Christian 10 commandments comes to mind. The fact that all of them are broken continuously by so called believers has nothing to do with them being excellent guiding principles.

[spacesailor]

Which One !.

I,m intrigued. To see my wife's misdemeanors. 

spacesailor

[Bruce Tuncks]

I reckon the ten commandments are bloody awful as life-guiding principles. They have NOTHING against slavery for just one example. Many ( too many ) of the ten commandments are based on the "no other gods allowed " stuff. This is of such obvious benefit to priests but could not possibly come from the god who would know beyond doubt that he was the only one of his type.

[spacesailor]

I,m still awaiting that a reply to " which " commandment do most break.

I have a few great grand kids ' born without '   Original sin !.

C section, it,s becoming Almost  common place for Safe birthing.

spacesailoe

[Bruce Tuncks]

Space, I dunno if c section is that safe...  the baby does not get the immunity from vaginal birth.

 

[Marty_d]

Not sure if you're breaking a commandment by having a C section.  Or is it the baby at fault?  It'd make about as much sense as anything else in that book.

[old man emu]

Childbirth is not mentioned in the Commandments, but a woman’s pain in childbirth is part of the suffering brought into the world through sin. As a direct result of the original sin, Adam, Eve, and the serpent were all cursed in one way or another. Genesis 3:16 lists one of the judgments for Eve’s sin as pain in childbirth: “I will make your pains in childbearing very severe; with painful labour you will give birth to children.”

It appears that, even before the fall, there would have been some pain in childbirth. God says, “I will greatly multiply your pain in childbirth” , using a Hebrew word meaning “to increase.” The pain of childbirth would be more than before. The pain was amplified.

[Old Koreelah]

3 hours ago, old man emu said:

Childbirth is not mentioned in the Commandments, but a woman’s pain in childbirth is part of the suffering brought into the world through sin. As a direct result of the original sin, Adam, Eve, and the serpent were all cursed in one way or another. Genesis 3:16 lists one of the judgments for Eve’s sin as pain in childbirth: “I will make your pains in childbearing very severe; with painful labour you will give birth to children.”

It appears that, even before the fall, there would have been some pain in childbirth. God says, “I will greatly multiply your pain in childbirth” , using a Hebrew word meaning “to increase.” The pain of childbirth would be more than before. The pain was amplified.

What in blazes is this original sin that we are all still paying for, thousands of years later?

[pmccarthy]

Cardinal Sin of the Philippines (who died in 2005) used to welcome visitors by saying "welcome to the house of Sin". I guess his father was the original Sin.

[nomadpete]

It is possible, although not provable, that 'original sin' was a strict liability act which is considered normal behaviour for any breedable pair of mammals. The particular individuals are now called Adam, and Eve. For unknown reasons, all subsequent humans (but not other mammals) must pay penalties for the actions of predecessors, acts over which which we have no control as the law seems retrospective.

 

To any normal human, it is difficult to understand how any supreme, all seeing, all knowing entity (especially one who actually created the mammals in question in his/her own image) could find anything negative about the alleged, mythical, 'original sin'. This is in spite of the fact that 'original sin' situation was created by the supreme creator.

 

It should logically follow that after the passage of at least 6,500 years, 'original sin' has been superseeded by 'new and improved sin'. For which no specific spiritual rules and penalties have been reliably specified.

 

There ... Is it all clear now?

 

Edited March 10, 2022 by nomadpete

[Jerry_Atrick]

Amen.... I think...

[old man emu]

12 hours ago, old man emu said:

It appears that, even before the fall, there would have been some pain in childbirth.

This seems to be either a contradiction, or there's some begetting not mentioned. Most of us take the story to be that there were two people in the Garden of Eden. Only after they were evicted did the population increase. So how did Eve experience the pain of childbirth prior to the fruit eating bit if she hadn't had children by then?

 

The book of Genesis tells us that Adam and Eve had two sons, Cain and Abel. After Cain kills Abel and settles in the land of Nod, we read that “Cain knew his wife, and she conceived and bore Enoch” (Gen 4:17). Since Adam, Eve, and their sons are the only humans the Bible has mentioned so far, the sudden appearance of Cain’s wife has troubled readers from ancient times to the present. Conservative readers point to a later verse, Gen 5:4, which states that Adam had “other sons and daughters,” arguing that Cain’s wife was his sister (or perhaps his niece) and that in the early days of humanity, marriage between brothers and sisters was both necessary and genetically safe.

[nomadpete]

It's funny how the bible avoids discussion about Adam's first wife.

Apparently Adam didn't like her wanting some equality, and also wanted a wife made from better material than clay.

But it means that the whole human race is ultimately the product of a broken marriage.

[Marty_d]

So what I want to know is, if we came from one breeding pair, who did their children breed with?

[Old Koreelah]

Christophee Hitching made a valid point when he asked why this omnicient god never intervened or took an interest in human affairs until a few thousand years ago; for the previous few hundred thousand years humans (and our cousins) had existed quite successfully without his help.

[onetrack]

O.K., I'll step in with my interpretation - and I believe in an omnipotent God, the One who created the Universe, and most things that are in it - but not everything. I believe at least one other God has the power of creation - and that God creates just mostly bad things.

But I don't go around, pushing "my brand" of religion into peoples faces. I'm happy enough for others to believe what they like. Maybe it's because I no longer follow any "established" religion. But I believe we are all doomed to die, and the Bible tells us that. That's one thing the evolutionists find hard to explain.

 

It is not unreasonable to understand that there's two sides to everything - to ensure balance. The old Yin-Yang thing - evil VS good - spiritual VS physical.

We live in a physical world, and it's difficult for us to comprehend that there's a Spiritual World that we cannot see, or carry out discourse with. But we get glimpses of that Spiritual world occasionally - ESP, ghosts, spooky happenings that we can't make sense of.

 

We can even occasionally meet a new person and interact with them, in an area where they seem a little out of place, and then that person can disappear without trace. I believe these events happen more often than is reported, and I believe spiritual beings can appear to us in human form, for unknown reasons, and then vanish without trace.

Witness the people who have seen long-dead people in broad daylight, who then suddenly evaporate. The mystery WW2 aircraft that appear and disappear without trace or tracking, in broad daylight. The ghosts of long-dead pilots or soldiers who appear to people who knew them - or who didn't. The stories are too many, to pass them all off as fiction.

Some of these events may be the product of an overly intense imagination, or a wish to be noticed - but a goodly percentage of them can't be easily explained.

 

The points I want to make -

1. The Universe and the Earth was made by the omnipotent God - the One who is Good and who represents all that we know is pleasing. In Genesis, the only real record we have of the early days of this planet, this book details the formation of the Earth as we know it, and many of the things in it. I believe our planet is as old as the radiocarbon dating says - not just 6000 years, as many Christian fundamentalists believe. 6000 years is the term of the Adamic creation, nothing else.

 

I don't believe my omnipotent God created everything that's in our world today - just many parts of it - the good things. This God also created an invisible spirit world, full of spiritual beings who cannot be readily or frequently seen by us mere mortals.

 

The bad things were created by one other God, who is intent on wreaking havoc and disruption, and who gains pleasure from seeing humans suffer - from War, sickness, disease, murders, etc. That God is Satan - the Evil One. He balances out the Good God.

Satan was one of Gods created Spiritual Beings who believed he was better than the Good God - and he has set out for aeons, to usurp the Good Gods power and control of the destiny of the Universe, and all that's in it.

Sort of like a would-be pilot wrestling with the controls of an aircraft, trying to take over from the nominated pilot.

 

But the Good God is in a constant fight with this Evil God - but he assures us, he will win - eventually. Just like two prizefighters having a match, they will each brag, that they will win - but there can only be one winner.

 

The Earth we live in, is the Planet of Good VS Evil. We are separated by vast distances and even dimensions of time and space, from other beings and other worlds. Earth is simply the Planet Battleground of the Universe.

We are born into it without choice, and we leave it mostly without choice.

 

Where we go after death is the eternal mystery. Why do people gather up such stupendous knowledge and skills, that are all then lost, when they die?

It's because we virtually all fail to understand the whole picture, and only concentrate on the Physical things we can see. There is a spiritual side to every part of life, that must be acknowledged.

 

2. In the Bible, nothing is said of other creations, or other Gods - apart from Satan. There are obviously other creations, many of which predate the recorded creation of Adam and Eve.

Satan more than likely indulged in creations of his own. I mean to say, the prehistoric world must have been a frightening place for humans to live. Who else but Satan would produce such creations as the prehistoric animals?

 

3. The story of the Bible is the story of the Adamic Race - nothing more, nothing less. The Bible is full of "who begat who". It's a tale of documented Ancestries - resulting in the 12 Tribes of Israel. The descendants of those 12 tribes now make up the major nations of the world - they've been pretty good breeders.

There were obviously other people inhabiting the Earth outside the Garden of Eden - as once Adam and Eve were thrown out of the Garden of Eden, they encountered other nations, or tribes - and they interacted and interbred with them.

 

4. The story of the Bible is all about Free Will and obedience to Gods instructions and Laws. Eve, and then Adam, decided to ignore Gods instructions, and to "eat of the forbidden fruit" (of the "Tree of Good and Evil").

The Bible wording is couched in much hidden meaning and strange wording. I simply believe that God set up the Garden of Eden with Adam and Eve in it as his chosen, perfect, obedient "tribe", shall we say, for want of a better word.

 

But Eve decided to be disobedient towards the Good God - the thing that the Good God hates most. Satan was placed in the Garden of Eden, represented by a Serpent in the Tree of Good and Evil. Perhaps Satan just made himself at home in the Garden of Eden - sort of like an unwanted Roof Rat moving into your house. Satan was/is charming, and made himself very attractive towards Eve.

In other words - he seduced her. He screwed her, it's that simple - against the Good Gods instructions that she have nothing to do with him. And when Satan screwed Eve, he planted the Seed of Evil in Her - and she gave birth to Cain - the worlds first recorded murderer of the Adamic race.

As anyone who has bred animals knows, there's a thing called telegony in breeding animals. It's important to ensure that virgin female stock is not inseminated first by inferior studs, or poor qualities in offspring may develop.

Telegony is dismissed by 20th and 21st century genetics experts - but mostly because no-one has ever carried out in-depth studies of telegony over a period of time, or even generations.

 

In humans, telegony has racial overtones, helped by Nazi beliefs. But the Nazis beliefs were all BS, developed by warped criminals to ensure that they stayed in power.

 

Now some scientists have discovered that telegony can happen in a species of fruit fly - so it's not a long-held, old wives tale or urban myth. Why is the Bible so dedicated to ancestral lines? There must be a reason.

I believe women do carry genetic stock from their former sexual partners. The recent episode of a woman boxing entrant in the Olympic Games testing positive to two banned substances used by her sexual partner, blew her away.

 

https://www.espn.com.au/olympics/summer/boxing/story/_/id/29299625/usada-clears-virginia-fuchs-doping-violation-caused-sex

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4282758/

As a result of Eve's Original Sin, the Adamic race, and all the people who have interbred with the Adamic race at some time, past or present - and that's virtually most of the people on Earth today - have inherited the Evil ones genetic stamp - regardless of how good and pure they are considered to be.

Eve's disobedience is the reason we are mortal, and we all have to die - and that's permanent - because the Good God told Eve, that was the punishment for disobeying Him. Sort of just like the Army, the whole platoon gets punished, for just one troublemaker.

 

This punishment - Eternal Death - is not because the Good God made this Rule up - it's because all things have to obey the Laws of Physics, Nature, whatever is inviolable in the Natural laws of our Universe.

Perhaps the Gods can change those Laws. Maybe they can in other Universes, and other Dimensions - I personally don't believe they can, for this world. Our Earth scene is set for Eternity.

The rules have been set for Earth, and it's Game On, no rule changing now. Why can't the rules be changed? - because the Game is in progress. What is the reason for the Game between Good and Evil? We aren't told, it's that simple.

 

But the Good God offers one Out from Eternal Death. It's called Salvation in the Bible, and it rests on the records that Jesus Christ was born of a Virgin of the Adamic race, as the offspring of the Good God, and that he died in lieu of all the people of Earth - but only if we believe in the Good God.

It's all free, and a pretty simple offer to me - just believe in the Good God, and his promises and covenants - to all people on this Earth - and you get a suitable reward in the form of Eternal Life. 

 

I'm quite happy to accept that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, and came to Earth and was born in human form, in an effort to save the people of Earth from Eternal Death.

As I have no experience of what happens after Death, I'm quite happy to accept that free ticket to a better existence after Death, because it costs me nothing, and the reward looks pretty good to me.

Call me simple if you like, call me uneducated, scoff at my beliefs, tear them apart, if it makes you feel better. But I've got a free ticket to a better life after death, and that's a lot more than the average atheist has.

 

 

Edited March 10, 2022 by onetrack