Should Drivers Be Required to Undergo a Biennial test

[Old Koreelah]

8 hours ago, willedoo said:

Those outback dirt roads are hard on tyres, especially the corrugated roads...

 

I think it depends on the luck of the draw as to whether or not a grader has been over it recently, and that's only temporary. I was led to believe that the corrugations go a fair way down under the surface…

Our lane is always badly corrugated; it belts hell out of our vehicles, no matter how slow we drive. Yesterday a grader and roller gave it a once-over. It was gloriously smooth afterwards. That afternoon the ruts were back.

[onetrack]

To get the ruts and corrugations out of roads, the grader driver needs to take a sharply-angled deep cut, from one side of the road, that cuts through to the bottom of the ruts.

This cut produces a decent-sized windrow, that is moved via as many passes as necessary, to the far side of the road.

This windrow is then picked up on return passes, and spread thinly across the road, until it peters out on the side where the first cut was initiated.

Then the material cast back across the road should be rolled, and it should be damp when this is done. Casting the material back across the road in a thin layer also pulls out the bigger stones and sticks.

That's why maintenance grading is best done at the end of Winter or the start of Spring, because the ground is wet through, and there's plenty of moisture to ensure the material cast back across the road is properly bound with rolling.

I've done more than my fair share of grader driving and road maintenance and road construction.

[pmccarthy]

I read somewhere that there were no corrugations when trucks had solid rubber tyres, up to about 1920, then they appeared when pneumatic tyres were introduced.

[Old Koreelah]

13 hours ago, pmccarthy said:

I read somewhere that there were no corrugations when trucks had solid rubber tyres, up to about 1920, then they appeared when pneumatic tyres were introduced.

Maybe air-filled tyres are on the way out:

 

[old man emu]

On 15/07/2022 at 10:41 PM, onetrack said:

That's why maintenance grading is best done at the end of Winter or the start of Spring, because the ground is wet through

This year you can do it up to New Year's Eve

[old man emu]

On 16/07/2022 at 12:48 AM, pmccarthy said:

I read somewhere that there were no corrugations when trucks had solid rubber tyres, up to about 1920, then they appeared when pneumatic tyres were introduced.

Axle loadings weren't as high then as they are now, and truck numbers were not what they are now. But I don't think it's the trucks. 

Several scientific studies into exactly how corrugations are formed have found the answer, which is definitive and simple.  You get corrugations any time large numbers of wheeled vehicles travel over a soft surface at speed.

 

Exactly how they are formed is easy to explain too. When a vehicle travels at speed on a soft surface there will inevitably be a little imperfection, an undulation in the smoothest of surfaces, maybe just a stone on the road, a variance in softness, or even braking hard to dig the wheels in. When the wheel travels over the undulation it will bounce slightly, reducing weight on the wheel for a moment, then landing a moment later which compresses the surface. That creates a tiny crest and dip, so guess what the next wheel over does…same again, but worsening the problem. Every subsequent wheel makes the problem worse and worse and then you have corrugations. It doesn’t matter how perfectly smooth the surface is to begin with, corrugations form anyway given enough time and speedy traffic.

[Old Koreelah]

There are usually bad corrugation zones just near intersections and after tight corners; anywhere that vehicles are braking or accelerating hard. I often hear rear wheel drive vehicles chattering as they accelerate up the hill near our place. Simply activating 4WD would reduce damage to our road.

[Jerry_Atrick]

M<aybe part of a driver biennial test is to drift over corrugations? 😉

[nomadpete]

Why not? Every new driver should, at the very least, be sent out on the skid pan to learn 'loss of control'. With an instructor of course. Otherwise they will just freeze on the controls when things go wrong on the roads.

 

We don't send a glider pilot solo until he/she has done the aviating equivalent.

[Old Koreelah]

Just came across this useful video on trailer sway. Seems that, like aircraft, there’s more to stability than getting the CoG in the right place. Mass distribution is also important.

 

My camper ended up with far too much weight on the towball, so the gas cylinder is going back behind the left wheel and a water tank is going behind the right wheel. That will likely correct the CoG, but add 30kg of water near the rear. This simulation shows some possible problems:

 

 

[spacesailor]

YES

I,m all for the " biennial drivers test !.

One test every other year after 80 years would be better than annuly. 

Those Aholes won,t let you drive home if you fail.

Instantly marooned at a test center.

spacesailor

[facthunter]

IF it's been PROVEN you don't meet the standard, how could they?  Imagine if you had an accident.. Nev

[Old Koreelah]

2 hours ago, facthunter said:

IF it's been PROVEN you don't meet the standard, how could they?  Imagine if you had an accident.. Nev

?

[spacesailor]

I have known a car driver Fail their test, because of  the female examiner ' deodorant / scent '. Cause a sneezing attack. 

Other,s include, 'not positioning the car correctly ' but no problems making the turn !. (  it allowed a car to proceed , behind him ). 

" not dressed to suit the examiner ".

Too many had passed successfully,  & quota filled. 

I, an abject licence failure,  have taught 100s of people to pass their test. Mostly medical students.

My wife ! " My first failure ". Doesn,t like to be told, by me, what to do !.

spacesailor

 

 

[facthunter]

Till you do the test it's not known that you don't meet the standard. Once you've failed it, it's on the record and you CAN'T be allowed to drive. IF there's a chance of failing take a spare driver, same as when you intend to drink. Nev

[Bruce Tuncks]

I looked up driving simulators and they are pretty good but only listed as games in general. I wonder why that is.

I reckon they could give a real score to a driver license candidate, and he could find out his score faster.

Also, they could include emergencies. I think simulators have been used for years by airlines, I remember their operators getting into trouble for overdoing things...  like making the poor pilot land in a thunderstorm with 3 engines out and the co-pilot raping the hostess.

[facthunter]

Never seen a simulator that had a programme like that. Perhaps it's an advert.   Nev

[willedoo]

Some of those basic simulators are funny. I had Microsoft FS9 and could land a fully laden F-4 Phantom at Lukla. Who needs a Twin Otter?

[facthunter]

That does  seem odd. Most get the figures true to type. I don't like the cheap ones. You can GAME them if you've spent a lot of time with them. Even the real ones to some extent but used properly you can go straight from the sim to there real thing on a conversion.. Nev

[Yenn]

I wouldn't like to be tested on a simulator. I have used X plane and made a copy of the Corby Starlet. I couldn't take off without crashing through fences and landing was only slightly better, even though it flew like the real thing for the rest of the time.

 I still reckon biannual testing would not get rid of the bad drivers. They would know they were being tested and be on their best behaviour. Photographic evidence of incompetent driving from a following police car could get rid of some menaces.

[nomadpete]

Occassional recertification would help. Most drivers couldn't pass a 'rules' test to save their life. So they might momentarily be reminded of the rules of the game. Likewise, few seem to know how to use a roundabout. Of course they would be on best behaviour for tests, but at least they would be reminding themselves how they should behave on the roads.

[facthunter]

These days I try to drive as though  I'm being tested each time. It concentrates my attention better. Things like what the traffic is doing around you and distances between vehicles and traffic lights changing. It does work I think. Nev

[nomadpete]

55 minutes ago, Yenn said:

Photographic evidence of incompetent driving from a following police car could get rid of some menaces.

Years ago, in NSW, any motorist could notify the police of dangerous driving as witnessed (dob in a driver) and the owner of the vehicle would be notified in writing that the vehicle had been seen doing such and such. It was not a revenue raiser, there was no attempt to identify the driver. But it aimed to improve driver behaviour by reminding drivers that whatever you do, somebody notices it.

 

Back then there was also a programme whereby some traffic infringements could have the fine waived if you attended some road safety lectures.

[spacesailor]

The " safe  "  traveling distance probably causes more rearender,s then any other Rule.

Every time l leave that Mandated distance,  some dickhead hoon tries to squeeze in the gap !.

Makes all cars slam on their brakes to avoid that ' asshole  '.

I,ve witnessed those idiots crossing from the right lane, to squeeze through your gap to exit the G,W,H, 

One hit those plastic barrels on the slip road , & just kept going. They don,t care !.

spacesailor

[nomadpete]

Spacey, some people are beyond help.

But until the lawmakers create serious demerit penalties, those dropkicks just keep right on putting innocents at risk.

 

My concept of serious penalty?

 

Drink driving? First offence.... crush the car. No matter whose car he drove - that's his problem to repay.

 

Speeding? Fine for first offence. Crush the car for second offence.

 

And so on.

 

It has repeatedly been proven that such offences all create high risk of death or maimed people in the event of any misjudgement by motorists.

As with aviation, the rules are written with the blood of people who believed 'it doesn't really matter. It won't hurt me'.

 

Or don't we really value the lives of the victims?