Examples of corruption in Australia

[Old Koreelah]

2 hours ago, Bruce Tuncks said:

 The best careers were for war babies and just before. Once, I went to hear an old guy ( 5 years older than me ) say how you should change your job at least every 5 years, like he had done…

As a Baby Boomer I was lucky to never be unemployed. I went into a CES on two occasions and came out a few minutes later with a job.

The glory days of Full Employment meant I could leave the pub at closing time, walk over The Bridge and down to Broadway and, for two bob, buy a Herald literally hot off the press. Find a job, walk to the address, perhaps via Binky’s Burger Bar. The boss would turn up and ask who of us had arrived first; you had a job.

 

[facthunter]

Leaving the Pub at closing time (6 O clock?) and then walking over "THE" Bridge?  What are you? An ironman?

[nomadpete]

Was that how Paul Hogan got his first painting job?

[Old Koreelah]

8 hours ago, facthunter said:

Leaving the Pub at closing time (6 O clock?) and then walking over "THE" Bridge?  What are you? An ironman?

Six O’clock closing? I’m not that old!
Kirribilli Pub closed at 10. Cheap accomodation in an old boarding house directly opposite the Opera House (51 Upper Pitt St.)

The walk to Broadway gave time to recover from the schooners of black.

[Marty_d]

36 minutes ago, Old Koreelah said:

schooners of black.

Eugh.  Beer should be the same colour going in as it is going out, in my opinion.  My wife likes Guinness, I'll stick with normal beer!

[Old Koreelah]

It used to be said that Guinness puts lead in your pencil. Too bad if you’ve got nothing to write on...

[Marty_d]

23 hours ago, Old Koreelah said:

It used to be said that Guinness puts lead in your pencil. Too bad if you’ve got nothing to write on...

...and cures all sorts of illnesses, recommended for pregnant women, better than Charles Atlas at giving you muscles... only the Irish could make this stuff up!

[Jerry_Atrick]

I remember the first time I tasted Guinness. It was at the Scots club, on, I think it was Queen street in Melbourne. Absolutely vile stuff.. tasted like the smell of petrol and diesel.. Vowed never to drink it again. Then I arrived in London and someone cajoled me into trying it. What a revelation.. silky smooth, lovely taste.. and creamy, too.. Then, I tried it in Dublin.. Suddenly., the London stuff tasted what I recalled from the Scots Club in Melbourne.

 

Alas, after a week of Guinees and McDonalds in Ireland (the local food was too difficult to try), I reeked of stockade.. They were so deadly, I was nicknamed the atomic bum.. I have never drunk Guinness again.

 

[facthunter]

 Guinness is a meal not just a drink. McDonalds is the risky bit.

[Jerry_Atrick]

You could argue that McDonalds is the drink...

[facthunter]

Easier to live dangerously in Ireland. Land of IRE.  Nev

[gareth lacey]

In 2019 toured Eire for 4 weeks," when in Rome do as the romans do: drank Guinness, only it does make for Black sxxt but so different to Aus Guinness 

 

[old man emu]

6 hours ago, Jerry_Atrick said:

I reeked of stockade.

That must have been a Brut!

[Yenn]

Guinness, Lovely stuff. I use d to drink eight pints per night when I was just about ready to leave the Pommy army. Gave it up overnight and couldn't sleep for a fortnight.

My doctor recommended Guinness, Rum and iron tablets. Guinness for strength, iron tablets for energy and Rum to give you ideas about what to do with the strength and energy.

I drank it bottled in the UK, until Guinness had it on tap at the pub by their hop fields at Bodiam, which was not far from my old mans pub near Hastings.

[nomadpete]

That's all very nice, but Guinness hardly qualifies as an example of corruption in Australia. What would you sceptics compare it with? Fourex or VB ?

[Jerry_Atrick]

Guinness hardly does, except the body can't process the iron in Guinness I am told, so its benefits are few and far between... except on the night, I suppose..

 

This may qualify, though..

 

 

[facthunter]

Helen Haines is no fool. She's one of the BEST Pollies in Canberra. in many ways including ethics. Nev

[Jerry_Atrick]

That may well be the case, but it still doesn't answer why she would support th hearings normally in private. Evidence gathering is normally done in private, and hearings - which examines the evidence and provides for testimoiny to answer/test the evidence - are normally done in public. Doofus has stated publicly that the bill is based on the NSW ICAC process, which he states the hearings are normally in private - this is wrong.. The hearings are normally in public; the information sessions (evidence gathering) is done in private. By Haines endorsing this without offering any other reason or justification, well, she is propagating the lie.

 

Haines may be no fool, but she has endorsed this opaque procerss to address corruption. Where you have opacity and power in the mix, you have a good risk ofd.. corruption. Politics is full of back room deals and I can't help but think maybe she has sold out for something she considers more important.

Edited November 3, 2022 by Jerry_Atrick

[old man emu]

In the Definitions section of the proposed Bill this is the definition of "public inquiry" on Page 17, lines 28 -29.

public inquiry:  means a public inquiry conducted by the Federal Integrity Commissioner under Part 5.

 

Here's a link to the Bill.

 https://www.aph.gov.au/Parliamentary_Business/Bills_Legislation/Bills_Search_Results/Result?bId=r6597

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Jerry_Atrick]

Yes...

 

But under the bill, under part 5, the use of a public inquriy is at the sole discretion of the commissioner, and the guidance is that it would be extrairdinary cicumstances for it.

 

Doofus himself has said it would be only in exceptional circumstances to hold public inquiries under the law.. in other words, it would be normal for them to be held in secret.

 

So, yes, the bill provides for public inquiries.. it doesn't mean they will happen all that often..

 

 

[facthunter]

ALL results will be made public. when  completed... Why call Drefus, Doofus? Once you do that. you can't pretend to be even handed..  Nev

[Jerry_Atrick]

Why call Morrison SFM? His actions define his nickname.

 

The outcome will be made public, but not the scrutiny of the evidence. How will anyone be able to have confidence in the proceedings?

 

As an AG, he will know jurisprudence.. and the legal theory v. the natural justice theory (BTW, both of which would probabkly coincide on this point)

 

That's why I call him Doofus at the moment.. Happy to refer to him by his real name if he can provide a justification for secret hearings..

Edited November 3, 2022 by Jerry_Atrick

[old man emu]

3 hours ago, Jerry_Atrick said:

But under the bill, under part 5, the use of a public inquiry is at the sole discretion of the commissioner

Reading further down into Part 6 Div 2 86(1)

The Federal Integrity Commisioner may hold a hearing for the purpose of:

1. investigating a corruption issue: or
2. conducting a public enquiry

 86(3) says that a hearing (or part) may be in public or private.

 

The word “may” is an expression of possibility, a permissive choice to act or not, and ordinarily implies some degree of discretion. This contrasts with the word “shall,” which is generally used to indicate a mandatory provision. I dare say the the FIC would have to put up a good case to justify applying that discretion in either direction.

[Jerry_Atrick]

I am well aware of the meanings of  the words. I believe I used the words "sole discretion" above.

 

But, an act has to be read in full to appreciate its actual meaning. So, instead of me saying it is intended to normally result in private hearings, let's hear it from the horses mouth:

 

 

[old man emu]

Is corruption such a part of these people's lives that they can't distinguish corrupt behaviour from correct behaviour?

 

He was asked to give an example of "serious corruption" or "systemic corruption" and he sidestepped by saying that he wasn't going to get into hypotheticals. There ar plenty of examples that he could have used to exemplify both term without using Australian examples. 

 

I define corrupt activity in the simple terms of "if you have to look over your shoulder to make sure no one can see what you are doing, that's corrupt activity". "If you and others are regularly doing something you don't want found out, that's systemic corruption."