Examples of corruption in Australia

[nomadpete]

Even if flawed, it it better than nothing.

It would be nice though, if all allegations could be transparently analysed. Secret hearings will definitely see this process used/abused for political manipulation.

[red750]

Voters have told The Age they care deeply about integrity in government.

 

So news that Premier Daniel Andrews is being investigated as part of a probe into how a Labor-linked union was promised more than $3 million to run a training program, without a competitive tender process and against the advice of bureaucrats, should spell trouble for the government.

 

But while election campaigns are unpredictable, don’t expect the Victorian opposition to make huge improvements in the polls.

 

It is likely that the revelations about the previously unreported Operation Daintree, which has kept anti-corruption investigators busy for two years, will only amplify the public’s disillusionment with the broader political class and drive fed-up Victorians to park their votes with independents or minor parties on November 26.

 

Murky political scandals have the potential to damage both Labor and the Liberals because they serve as a reminder of how major party politics works behind closed doors.

[old man emu]

14 hours ago, red750 said:

the public’s disillusionment with the broader political class and drive fed-up Victorians to park their votes with independents or minor parties on November 26.

Is it a reasonable hypothesis that the electorate is becoming better politically educated and is abandoning blind faith and tradition is deciding which politicians it chooses? Is there a swing to a position whereby the attributes of a person seeking to be the Local Member are more important that the person's political affiliation? In other words, are people more likely to want to vote for the person who says they will seek to do good for the electorate and ignore the internal power games of a Party?

[facthunter]

BIG CLIVES mob promised many good things they had no hope of being in a position to deliver. Craig Kelly was going to be the PM, and spending 80 million on advertising was completely Democratic?? Nev

[Bruce Tuncks]

While I really like the idea of transparent hearings, the idea  that baseless accusations could be used for political reasons needs answering.

Personally, I reckon that there are several ways around this, for example there could be big penalties for false accusations , or the hearings are only closed to begin with and then have to be opened up.

[facthunter]

ALL results/findings will be made available. When you get newspapers saying "IT was alleged" (and don't say and immediately withdrawn) as big headlines  you get to realise what is going on. The TURC was set up to provide headlines right up to an election costing taxpayers some 70 million. Nev

[old man emu]

You can't trust anything in newspapers nowadays. They can't even report on lawn bowls without bias.

[facthunter]

IF  ONLY that was the main problem with Mainstream News. Don't read the stuff It's BS and a waste of trees. Nev

[onetrack]

I struggle to find anything worthy in todays newspapers. All the good journos have left, and the papers are full of crap stories about entertainment personalities, sports personalities, and criminals activities. 

Then when you get past all that, you find page after page, after insert after insert, full of ads for stuff you don't want!!

[facthunter]

Look who owns them and WHY they own them. Murdoch Costello and Stokes   (who I used to have a bit of time for,  Murde och is not even an Australian citizen but the AUSTRALIAN newspaper is his loss making political BIG GUN.  Nev

[Jerry_Atrick]

Back to the question of private hearings for the federal ICAC. The argument that it is to protect pollies reputations who are unfairly accursed is a furphy. Firstly, as we can see in Vic, if someone wants to leak news that a pollie is subject to an ICAC, then not knowing in what capacity sets the press on a frenzy. What has Dan done? Was it the 3.5m payment to whatever it was alleged, etc?

 

Secondly, a referral to an ICAC is a referral of a potential crime. As I understand, there investigations of crimes are generally performed in private. Once it goes to charge. the evidence gathered in those investigations is tested in public. That is the bar we should be aiming at. I agree, the mere accusation can destroy reputations - just look at men who are accused of sexual offences that are acquitted even when there isn't a shred of more than loose circumstantial evidence. So, if we think that pollies reputations should be absolutely protected until at least the hearing, then there are a few protections I can think of that could be put in place. For example, a by default gag order from reporting anyone who is the subject of a referral, or reporting enough to be able to infer who it is (except where it has been made public by the subject themselves, for example). There could also be criminal liability for vexatious or frivolous referrals so that those trying to simply sabotage a career will end up with a criminal record (and presumably no longer be able to hold office... not sure about that one).

 

And even if they are to report how are they to report? Is it a list of the referrals, a summary of the referrals, and a judgement? Sounds OK, but consider Galdys recent examination at the NSW ICAC... She seemed to be able to remember everything so she could deny wrong doing right up until her ICAC attendance, where she suddenly came down with an acute case of selective amnesia. With testimony and the equivalent of full court reports be provided? If even if they are, how impactful will they be compared to being able to see it and have it reported on?

 

I am not convinced at all about the arguments for private hearings, except where the national or state interests (not the national or state pollies interests) is at stake.

Edited November 14, 2022 by Jerry_Atrick

[old man emu]

9 hours ago, Jerry_Atrick said:

As I understand, there investigations of crimes are generally performed in private. Once it goes to charge. the evidence gathered in those investigations is tested in public.

That has long been the way police have operated in investigating any sort of crime. Just listen to the way police media informs the Press about any sort of investigations. No name, no pack drill. 

 

"A person is assisiting police with their enquiries", means "we've nabbed a likely lad and are presently giving him the third degree". I still practise the habit of feigning ignorance if someone asks about a sensitive matter. I only do it rarely because most of the time my ignorance doesn't need to be feigned.

[facthunter]

Yes  I'm just pretending to be a SOB too so you'll let down your guard  Nev

[Jerry_Atrick]

Here ya go.. A template for the reports from ther federal ICAC of cases held in public:

 

[Jerry_Atrick]

OK.. You know I am on  a YT rabbit hole.. But Doofus has talked the talk... Is he going to walk the walk? (OK.. that was pretty shmultzy.. but while Albo is defintiely looking the goods, Doofus is not, yet)

 

 

[old man emu]

I thought that Cormann's bid for the position of  Secretary-General of the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD) was another example of ScoMo 'jobs for the boys' exercise, but reading of his nomination was supported both by the Liberal government and federal Labor, while the Labor Premier of Western Australia Mark McGowan provided a reference for it. I didn't realise that he was held in such great esteem by Labor, despite his being a long time member of the Conservative government.

 

Cormann follows the practices of his chosen Christian Church, but personally opposed same-sex marriage and in 2017 argued "for a postal vote plebiscite to be held before a parliamentary vote on the issue", after that survey went ahead and found most Australians support same-sex marriage, he chose to vote in favour of the bill legalising same-sex marriage. A big personal change, but one that let him do the duty our democratic system required of him.

 

I still think he's a squarehead.

[facthunter]

Compared to the rest of his mob he's almost OK. People could work with him and he put in the effort.  Nev

[nomadpete]

To me he seemed pretty good at glib bs

 

Should I have said 'politispeak'. ?

Edited November 17, 2022 by nomadpete

[facthunter]

I'm mainly going on what w few Labor Pollies have said. Perhaps not too publicly.  An ex NSW Lib. premier even stood up for Andrews and was roundly condemned for it by his cohorts  especially GUY  But HE reneged on a "Pairs" agreement so what can you expect? Nev

[Bruce Tuncks]

I like the story about Cormann and the same-sex marriage stuff, but why stop there?

For example, most Australians are against gambling advertisements being shown when kids may be watching TV.

BUT no way are we offered a vote on it.....   Shame, say I. Corruption?   What else could it be?

[old man emu]

13 minutes ago, Bruce Tuncks said:

gambling advertisements

You just stepped into a big pile of poop. 

 

Who has the money to wipe it off and get rid of the smell. Certainly neither side of the Dispatch Boxes.

[facthunter]

"Clubs Australia " has far too much Power and I hope it's being recognised and reigned in. Per Capita WE have by far the most Pokies in the world by multiples of the next highest. . It's a "CANCER" eating out society. Nev

[spacesailor]

It tells how BAD gambling is .

When, they can blank out the " daylight " so the suckers don`t know how long they`ve been in the place .

spacesailor

[Marty_d]

Someone was talking about it on Big Ideas tonight.  It's proven behaviour that people get a dopamine rush when they win (even a small amount), but when you lose money there is an almost uncontrollable desire to make good.  Gambling gives a "chance" of that which is why people throw good money after bad.

It's all human psychology, the gambling industry knows it well, and they make squillions from the people who can least afford it.

[Jerry_Atrick]

It is the reason why people call stock trading gambling.. People make a small amount of money and they are on the high and are willing to pile in when they are losing.. Which means, they tend to buy high and sell low to get out of the loss..