Blockies

[Yenn]

I see in today’s news that the shooting in Qld, near Chinchilla is caused by people living on blocks with no water or sewerage or power. They are second class citizens deprived of all the niceties of city living and supposedly missing out on everything good about city living. This is just because they are cheap to buy.

I have just sold my el cheap block for over half a million dollars, which is probably nearly as much as I earned in my working life.

Living on a block is far superior to town living, room to move, you don’t have to listen to neighbours and their dogs and kids on motorbikes roaring around the streets. You can supply your own tank water which is nowhere near as nasty tasting as town water. The kids can be brought up in a nice environment and there is the school bus for them.

I can not see what could cause people living that lifestyle to want to commit mass murder, but I can see that it is a great opportunity for so called experts to come up with a load of crap.

I have moved into sloburbia on Boyne Island and while I have water and sewerage I also have traffic noise, neighbours and it also seems hotter. The only plus is that I no longer have the maintenance, such as weed and fuel control. I don’t feel any need to go out and kill people any less than I did in the last 43 years living on a block.

 

[red750]

From reports in the news, and I know you guys don't believe a word of it, they were American-style redneck, gun loving doomsdaay preppers who had a hate against the world, and supposedly, two brothers married to the same woman. Total nutters.

[Jerry_Atrick]

Red has hit it on the head.. also a toxic love triangle, total domineer, if that is the word.. Used to gut wild pigs alive and make sure the local footy ground was reeking of the blood and guts.. Domestic violence, estranged from society despite being senior in schools in the education system. Clearly a few screws loose (in the metaphorical and not offensive context).. Maybe mental health intervention when people noticed things awy but thought it was none of their business may have helped. Lucky no kids were taken out in the whole thing. Not your average person looking for some solitude.

 

RIP the police officers and the neighbour. They didn't deserve it.

Edited December 15, 2022 by Jerry_Atrick

[Yenn]

As I said, all caused by living on a block!

[Jerry_Atrick]

No way.. Reas the reports.. started long before they moved to that block.

[facthunter]

They SOUGHT to live unconnected to society and fortify it in an isolated place . Their on line activity gives an indication of what "space" they were in.  Nev

[red750]

One thing I left out of my post above was 'conspiracy theorists'.

[red750]

This from the Sydney Morning Herald:

 

The couple at the centre of the Wieambilla shooting had posted videos online in the weeks leading up to, and night of, the fatal confrontation with police on their regional Queensland property, in which they claimed to have killed the “devils” and “demons”.

 

A since-deleted YouTube account and alternative video hosting site feature details from the lives of Stacey and Gareth Train — along with his brother Nathaniel, who does not feature but is spoken about — weeks before Monday’s events.

 

In the most recent of the videos posted to the Mrs Yugi Girawil YouTube channel, published at 7.39pm on Monday, Gareth said: “They came to kill us and we killed them”.

 

“If you don’t defend yourself against these devils and demons you’re a coward,” Gareth says.

 

One of the accounts features the name Daniel, Gareth’s middle name. The pair refer to themselves as Daniel and Jane in the videos. Jane was Stacey’s middle name.

 

All three were shot and killed by police after what has been described as an “ambush” killing of two of the four officers sent to the property — constables Matthew Arnold and Rachel McCrow — about 4.30pm in response to a NSW police missing person report for Nathaniel.

 

Neighbour Alan Dare was also shot dead after going to investigate the hours-long siege.

[Old Koreelah]

1 hour ago, Yenn said:

I see in today’s news that the shooting in Qld, near Chinchilla is caused by people living on blocks with no water or sewerage or power. They are second class citizens deprived of all the niceties of city living and supposedly missing out on everything good about city living. ..

I’d suggest being brought up with extreme religion and their exposure to American-sourced “the guvmint is coming to get you” crap is to blame. Australians (including our governments) import too much of the worst that the USA has to offer.

 

1 hour ago, Yenn said:

Living on a block is far superior to town living, room to move, you don’t have to listen to neighbours and their dogs and kids on motorbikes roaring around the streets. You can supply your own tank water which is nowhere near as nasty tasting as town water. The kids can be brought up in a nice environment and there is the school bus for them...

Totally agree, Yenn. That’s what we did. Bought a cheap, eroded block to rehabilitate. Installed septic and own own water supply for the price of a new car. Built our own home based on the sustainability trends of the 80’s. 

Don’t agree about the noisy motorbikes; there are now lots more blocks near us and the first thing the new owners do, even before building a house, is buy their kids lots of noisy dirty bikes…

[facthunter]

Kids being occupied with Motorbikes is not the worst thing that could happen. Nev

[Old Koreelah]

Giving kids brand-new bikes may be the problem. They get flogged for a few months then discarded.

Like many of us old farts on here, they’d derive greater benefit if they’d had to buy well-used bikes with money they’d earned. Instead of spending their waking hours torturing the retired couples next door, they’d be learning to the repair and maintain the bloody things!

[facthunter]

Most of them aren't fitted with Loud exhausts and you can't go full bore all the time in a paddock.  You can't use your iPhone while riding also and they do learn skills.. Nev

[willedoo]

The term blockies is a very broad sword. In the area I live, there are a lot of residential acreage blocks once you get out of the towns. They probably vary from one acre up to about thirty on average. Some smaller blocks are the result of rural residential subdivision developments, while others like mine are on original long standing historical titles. Historically, it's an area that consisted of many small rural titles. The smaller blocks are generally scattered around the hills, while a lot of the neighbouring flat land is made up of farms. As a consequence, the demographic is varied. Battlers, farmers, and millionaires all live side by side.

 

The so called blockies in the district where the shootings occurred are a different thing altogether. Most of those blocks are the result of fly by night development companies buying large grazing properties in very poor marginal country, and cutting them into smaller blocks. The country is generally timbered with poor sandy soil, and limited grasses of poor nutritional value. In their day as a cattle property, the best they would have done is to be a breeding property, or what they call a drought block. The only subdivisions with half decent soil are the ones done in melon hole country, which has it's own negative qualities.

 

The slice up of land into blocks has been going on for forty years or more. I remember back in the early 80's, a Victorian development company (who shall remain nameless) bought up heaps of land in what you would call the Western Downs of Queensland. After subdividing the blocks, they were mainly advertised to potential interstate buyers, with glossy, enhanced photos depicting cheap acreage blocks in sunny Queensland. A lot of buyers bought them sight unseen, and got the shock of their lives when they found out how bad the blocks were. Some were advertised as being in the coastal hinterland, when in reality they were at least five hours drive west of the coast. That particular company was sailing close to the breeze when it comes to laws on fraud and false advertising.

 

Since those days, blocks have been sold and resold many times over. It's the type of land that will never appreciate in value, and the block subdivisions have become a monoculture  and a ready made battler's ghetto. There would no doubt be some good people living on those blocks, but the blocks have a reputation of being a haven  for druggies and deadbeats. Very few average citizens would take on living there. It's the type of area that if you went away for a few days, you would stand a high chance of returning to a burgled property. What makes it worse is the chance that the perps would be your neighbours. My comments about the blockies in that region might sound a bit harsh, but anyone who knows the area would know what I'm talking about, as it has a bad reputation. An incident like the one that has just happened doesn't surprise a lot of people given the location. If you cut up large properties into cheap, poor quality blocks in the middle of nowhere, It's no surprise that a big percentage of the dwellers will be crack heads and ice addicts.

[Yenn]

It does seem that the area was not the best, but the news article I read made out that all blockies were the same, which is just bullshit. Do gooders or self proclaimed experts trying to push their barrows.

[facthunter]

Yenn you know how news articles sensationalise things. Stay sane and don't read the $#!T.    Nev

[nomadpete]

Will, I know the area and generally agree with your comments.

Except I wouldn't really call it 'timbered'.  The parched soil devoid of topsoil out that way, only grows straggly stunted stuff.

 

It is country where a true treehugger wouldn't find a real tree to love.

Edited December 16, 2022 by nomadpete

[old man emu]

21 hours ago, willedoo said:

the block subdivisions have become a monoculture  and a ready made battler's ghetto.

Sounds like the rural version of the city 'Houso' estates. Same population; same problems, but more room.

[onetrack]

The problem with these low-density areas is that sickos like this trio can exist and continue to descend into their morass of mental instability, and have it reinforced by joining forums and groups (that are invariably U.S.-based) who specialise in this particularly murderous, visceral, foamy-mouthed hatred of "Guvmint" and "Authority" that has it roots in the murderous, resentful, authority-resisting lowland Germans of the 1700's who went to America specifically as mercenaries.

 

Interestingly, the lowland Germans fought on both sides - they were employed by the English to fight the Americans, and the Americans used them to fight off Monarchial rule from England.

30,000 Hessians were hired by the British, and they incurred intense hatred from the American colonists for their military brutality.

These Germans came from the German states of the 1600's, where militarism was rife, and soldiering was regarded as a premium occupation. The thinking in these Germanic states was that authority resided only in the carrying of firearms.

As a result, these German States ended up with sizeable numbers of well-trained and efficient soldiers who were quite readily available for hire as mercenaries - particularly where key words like "freedom", "tyrannical Govt", "corrupt leaders", "sovereignty being oppressed", and the crushing of Fundamentalist Christian beliefs was seen, or believed to be happening.

 

Add in a good dose of fundamentalist Christianity in these Lowland Germans, with the belief that "God" was always on their side - and a constant distrust of anyone from a Government dept or ruling authority (Kingly or otherwise), and we get a long list of people who - along with a good dose of paranoia - have developed into "doomsday preppers", "Anti-authoritarianism" groups, "Libertarians", "Sovereign Citizens", "Anti-Vaxxers", "Qanon", Conspiracy Theorists (including the White Power and the "Great Replacement" true believers) the "Posse Comitatus" groups, and associated deranged nutters - who all feed off each other - and who as a combined group, have been responsible for some of the worst attacks and mass murders carried out on authorities and innocents (in the U.S. primarily - but also in other countries), in the last 50 years. 

 

Amongst these we can include David Koresh, the Oklahoma City bombers, the "Posse Comitatus" murders, many of the mass firearm murders in the U.S., Brenton Tarrant, and so on. I can't find a full list of right wing extremism mass murders, but it would be an extensive list.

And the over-riding feature of all these murderous deranged individuals, is an overwhelming love and outright worship of firearms - because they are basically killers, and firearms give you vastly increased killing power.

Add in the extremely domineering and control-freak natures that usually feature large in these peoples natures, and the scene is set for their murderous rampages.

 

I fail to understand how this trio escaped attention for so long, as they spiralled into their malevolent black hole. The brothers father is supposed to be a Christian Pastor - yet he was reported as being estranged from them, and hadn't had contact with them for a reported 23 years. So much for his style of "Christianity".

The police monitor chat sites and forums constantly looking for pedophiles - and I thought they monitored extremist chat rooms and sites to flush out deviants like the Trains. But obviously not - or perhaps they did see their posts and dismissed them.

 

I also fail to understand why locals weren't more alert to the distinctly anti-social and deviant behaviour, that Gareth Train in particular, was displaying for many years. The Qld Police had apparently already paid a visit to the Trains earlier in a "welfare check". This shows there was some kind of recognition that the Trains were on the radar somewhere along the line, but that their murderous plans were not recognised, nor was any further escalation of inquiries planned.

 

The bottom line is that this type of extreme Right Wing Fundamentalism must be recognised for what it is - a pack of deranged nutters feeding off each other, and supporting each other - and they pose just as big a threat to our society, as any Islamic Fundamentalist nutters. Fundamentalists are just simply all extremist nutters, and they all deserve to be identified, and kept track of, 24/7.

 

And of course, constant checks on deviously hidden accumulations of firearms and explosives must be a permanent standard check. Police have already uncovered quite a few of these caches, I can pretty well guarantee there's a lot more out there, yet to be found, and the cache owners exposed. One of the methods these groups favour is the building of bunkers, and Police like to be tipped off by contractors when sea containers are being buried and used as bunkers.

I would not be in the least surprised to find that the Trains have a hidden bunker somewhere, that has not been found.

 

https://www.adl.org/resources/report/murder-and-extremism-united-states-2021

 

https://everytownresearch.org/report/armed-extremism-primer-sovereign-citizens/

 

 

 

Edited December 17, 2022 by onetrack

[spacesailor]

I doubt that area is ' residential ' ! .

More likr ' rural ' as in subdivided farms .

My ' low density housing  area ' is the proverbial  1/4 acre block .

High density  is a mass of ' high rise flats ' ! .

THE FUTURE GHETTOS .

spacesailor

Edited December 17, 2022 by spacesailor
Spelling

[facthunter]

The population in certain suburbs is very Dense. Nev

[red750]

5 hours ago, spacesailor said:

THE FUTURE GHETTOS .

What do you mean 'future'. Many are currently.

[spacesailor]

A LOT in the next suburb are onlya few years old , & as yet still looking in reasonable condition. 

In 5 to ten years , with 50% more people , the small suburb will be over populated .

YET

The banks have left , the Commonwealth bank the last to go .

spacesailor

[onetrack]

Geez, the story gets better and better now, as the information trickles out. Now a farmer near the NSW/QLD border has reported that Nathaniel Train busted through the closed NSW border last December in his 200 series Landcruiser.

 

He tried to ram the 'Cruiser through the locked gates, and when that failed, he produced an angle grinder and cut the lock and drove through. Then he ran into sections of flooded road at speed and basically killed the 'Cruiser engine.

So then Train jumped out of the 'Cruiser and started dumping firearms and knives in the floodwaters - loaded firearms, too. Then when the farmer towed his 'Cruiser into his yard, Train borrowed his phone and started speaking to someone in "code".

 

The farmer dropped Nathaniel Train about 6 kms up the road, where he was picked up by someone else. After he'd gone, the farmer found documentation about Train thrown into the floodwaters - including his work history.

The farmer was so concerned about the "sketchiness" of Train, he rang the Police and asked if the 'Cruiser was stolen. It sounds like he never mentioned all the guns and knives. He did mention the border-busting effort.

 

The Police weren't interested, because the 'Cruiser wasn't stolen - and apparently it's O.K. to bust through a closed border using an angle grinder, and to transport large quantities of (almost certainly illegal) firearms across the border. 

This whole episode demands a Commission of Inquiry into how the QLD Police have been so incompetent from start to finish, in this whole sorry disaster. I thought the W.A. Police were pretty incompetent, it looks like the QLD Police are even worse.

 

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-12-17/qld-police-shooting-nathaniel-train-rammed-border-dumped-guns/101783696

 

Edited December 17, 2022 by onetrack

[red750]

At 2 am Sunday, police guarding the site of the police shootings caught two local men, 23 and 25, looting motorbikes from the property. They had parked down the road, walked through bush and were pushing the bikes back to their vehicle when captured. 

 

The two alleged looters have both been charged with with one count each of unlawful trespass, stealing by looting and two counts of supply dangerous drug (cannabis) in unrelated matters.

[onetrack]

Just goes to show the classy level of the "blockies". They must all be refugees from the biggest criminal suburbs in the cities.

 

https://www.perthnow.com.au/news/crime/men-allegedly-loot-police-shooting-site-c-9202453