Robodebt Royal Commission - Exposing a Travesty

[nomadpete]

How many episodes of this sad saga must we endure?

 

I can almost hear the strident intro chords of 'Blue Hills, by Gwen Meridith.......in today's episode......"

Which I think was the world's longest running radio serial.

 

😞

 

[Jerry_Atrick]

As many on this and more to come, until we, the people, are prepared to stick it to those who perptuate it.

 

It is time to have a law that holds pollies and the SES to account for reckless and intentional misconduct - to the point of denyiung their freedom and stripping them of awards, non contributory pensions and other perks their employ gives them.. I leave negligent out, as that staddles incompetence.. There hasn't been much in this series that has not shown at least recklessness.

 

And a press council that can do the same to press (MSM and Social Media) pundits that do the same.

Edited June 11, 2023 by Jerry_Atrick

[facthunter]

The money running the Press Council comes from the newspapers. Nev

[spacesailor]

When did those Servants ( public) .

Become our Masters ? .

spacesailor

[nomadpete]

12 hours ago, Jerry_Atrick said:

we, the people, are prepared to stick it to those who perptuate it

Fine.

 

Now, explain again for me, just what avenues are available for 'we people' to stick it to them?

 

And don't fall back on that old 'vote them out' fallacy.

 

We cannot vote the bureaucrats out. Public have no say in bureaucrat selection.

 

We cannot even vote the politicians out. We are only permitted to vote the least worst politicians 'in'.

 

 

[facthunter]

An "INFORMED VOTE" makes Democracy work. It's the ultimate answer, but so many don't take it seriously.  Nev

[nomadpete]

13 hours ago, facthunter said:

An "INFORMED VOTE" makes Democracy work. It's the ultimate answer, but so many don't take it seriously.  Nev

Only true if there is a obviously ethical candidate to vote for.

[facthunter]

  They are not all BAD. It's a hard job to do and have people aware of the work put in. The "Viewspapers" write their Biased opinions to serve their OWN  interests..  Nev

[Old Koreelah]

For those of us suffering Robodebt Fatigue, this short summary from today’s Guardian seems about right:

 

[old man emu]

The place the punishment should start is in those electorates that voted for the perpetrators like ScoMo. If the voters chose rogues like him, then one wonders what their morals are. And I'm sad to say that I was born and raised in ScoMo's electorate.

 

[facthunter]

He's not called "Scotty from Marketing " (which HE hates), for nothing. His father was a policeman and  the "daggy Dad" said he would be a tough Cop on the Block. He's a clever manipulator so I'd cut the electorate a bit of slack. The Sharks are talking about removing his Honorary position and I guess the $15 Mill statue of Cook is out of the question. Sco Mo's Captain's PICK, Craig Kelly, was a monumental FLOP also..His CV wouldn't read too well and he  was a big player in the ROBODEBT saga

[spenaroo]

Was having a conversation with my father the other day about religion and tax status.
He is fairly high in the church and was talking about the disconnect between the ministry and the organizational side.
-the ministry has no issue, as it should be an example to the world. and paying taxes would help the community image.

-the organizational side see it as their role to minimize expense and do what they see as being is in the churches best interests.
they see their role as ensuring the church is as financially secure as possible - and serve to the best of their ability to do that.

I wonder if a similar situation has happened here. where the disconnect between the services and the organizational side has occurred.

Edited July 11, 2023 by spenaroo

[Old Koreelah]

4 hours ago, old man emu said:

The place the punishment should start is in those electorates that voted for the perpetrators like ScoMo. If the voters chose rogues like him, then one wonders what their morals are. And I'm sad to say that I was born and raised in ScoMo's electorate.

…so, being guilty of electing these ghouls, according to Fiona, the currently unemployed Bettong, you deserve to be jeered in the streets, banned from public office and forced to live in a drain near a chemical factory, till the end of time? 
Meanwhile, the bastards who caused so much misery to poor people seem to be still (as Fionas says) in cushy government jobs.
 

[rgmwa]

The disconnect was between the schemer's plans to recover alleged debts and the law.

[Old Koreelah]

Not so much a disconnection as a yawning gulf between their sworn duty and their actual attitude to the poor they we sworn to assist.

[onetrack]

I am (but I probably shouldn't be), appalled to find the major player in the Robodebt scam (because that's about all it ever was), Kathryn Campbell, got sideshuffled into a cushy job overseeing Defence spending on the new submarines - at a salary of $900,000!!!

 

FFS!! The PM only gets $565,000 for running the entire country!! Yet this public service scumbag not only avoids any Robodebt penalty, she actually MOVES UP in positioning and renumeration!!

 

I trust the RC results in serious charges against the major players in this scam, and they actually face some real penalties.

 

Edited July 11, 2023 by onetrack

[Old Koreelah]

How long should we maintain the rage about Robodebts?

Our model might be the vicious campaign against Rudd’s well-intentioned and quite effective home insulation scheme.  That went on for years; so many dumb voters swallowed the training and every reference to Peter Garrett had to be couched in terms of “the pinkbatts fiasco”. 

[facthunter]

The "Safety' aspect was a State responsibility also. Rudd left Peter Garret out to dry. Not nice.   Nev

[Jerry_Atrick]

I intend to read the full report mytself - minus the sealed section, of course. Can't trust the MSM and my go to on You Tube, Knights in Shining Llama, will probably take a while to get his synopsis out.

 

However, the sealed section is important on two points: First those that may have commited a criminal offence have been referred to the AFP. The AFP have har allegations of corruption and dereliction of duty (by extending enforcement in excess of the law) to suit their political masters. The whistleblower cases are an example.  I doubt powerbrokers in the AFP have moved on, so it would be interesting to see how the investigations unfold over time. Second, those being referred to the NACC; by default all hearings are in private, unless there is an exceptional public interest to hold them in public. It will be interesting to see if this qualifies as in the public interest (how any hearing on public corruption is not in the public interest is beyond me). If this isn't I wonder what would wualify.

 

I think the Royal Commissioner did a fantastic job, generally - at least in the operation of the hearing. However, I think what has been reported could be improved.

 

I get the sealed section is to not prejudice any potential proceedings. Bill Shorten is seeking legal  advice about whether and when the names referred for investigations can be revealed. I think the commissioner could have added a time limit to holding the sealed section sealed to get the agencies moving on this. If the agencies needed more time for any specific individual, then they could then apply to a court for an order extending the seal. If course, this coudl backfiure as if the agencies want the investigation to fail, they do nothing until the time limit, expires, unsear the remainder of the report, and allow the press to prejudice any proceedings.

 

Transparency for eveything but the most important national security interests is a must for a properly functioning democratic system.

 

The other thing that was disappointing is they effective barring of compensation claims on the grounds of cost. This is arbitrary, and given the nature and the effects of the case, including lost lives through suicide through relentless, disingenuous, and pernicial pursuit of alleged debts, is a blight on an otherwise sterling discharge of her duties. How much does Australia subsidise multinational corporates through taxation breaks, and the like; If we tightened that up a bit, and too a real cut for the wealth they manage to claim and export, then the cost would not be as prohibitive as the denial of natural justice.

 

Gordon Legal have announced they are reviewing the evindece of Robodebt and are accusing the departments of witholding vital evidence which would have allowed the pursuit of further hardship as well as punitive damages.  I wish them every bit of luck.

 

[facthunter]

This was the Nasties, mean spirited rotten performance ever imposed on a section of the society they had villified from day one when they first got elected.  You also had your Bank account frozen for the period when under review and every time you rang up (IF you even got through) , it would be a different person. IF you went to the ombudsman, the advice would be "just pay it".  How do you keep a Tradie business going under those circumstances. I hope the Bastards fry in hell after they ROT in Gaol   Nev

Edited July 11, 2023 by facthunter

[nomadpete]

23 minutes ago, Jerry_Atrick said:

I intend to read the full report mytself - minus the sealed section, of course. Can't trust the MSM and my go to on You Tube, Knights in Shining Llama, will probably take a while to get his synopsis out.

 

However, the sealed section is important on two points: First those that may have commited a criminal offence have been referred to the AFP. The AFP have har allegations of corruption and dereliction of duty (by extending enforcement in excess of the law) to suit their political masters. The whistleblower cases are an example.  I doubt powerbrokers in the AFP have moved on, so it would be interesting to see how the investigations unfold over time. Second, those being referred to the NACC; by default all hearings are in private, unless there is an exceptional public interest to hold them in public. It will be interesting to see if this qualifies as in the public interest (how any hearing on public corruption is not in the public interest is beyond me). If this isn't I wonder what would wualify.

 

I think the Royal Commissioner did a fantastic job, generally - at least in the operation of the hearing. However, I think what has been reported could be improved.

 

I get the sealed section is to not prejudice any potential proceedings. Bill Shorten is seeking legal  advice about whether and when the names referred for investigations can be revealed. I think the commissioner could have added a time limit to holding the sealed section sealed to get the agencies moving on this. If the agencies needed more time for any specific individual, then they could then apply to a court for an order extending the seal. If course, this coudl backfiure as if the agencies want the investigation to fail, they do nothing until the time limit, expires, unsear the remainder of the report, and allow the press to prejudice any proceedings.

 

Transparency for eveything but the most important national security interests is a must for a properly functioning democratic system.

 

The other thing that was disappointing is they effective barring of compensation claims on the grounds of cost. This is arbitrary, and given the nature and the effects of the case, including lost lives through suicide through relentless, disingenuous, and pernicial pursuit of alleged debts, is a blight on an otherwise sterling discharge of her duties. How much does Australia subsidise multinational corporates through taxation breaks, and the like; If we tightened that up a bit, and too a real cut for the wealth they manage to claim and export, then the cost would not be as prohibitive as the denial of natural justice.

 

Gordon Legal have announced they are reviewing the evindece of Robodebt and are accusing the departments of witholding vital evidence which would have allowed the pursuit of further hardship as well as punitive damages.  I wish them every bit of luck.

 

Jerry, you probably now have "high risk" notations on your ASIO file.

You pose a serious risk to National Security by using language such as "transparency", and "in the public interest".

 

Such activities undermine our democratic process (as we generally implement such).

 

Edited July 11, 2023 by nomadpete
PS I am probably on their file too, because I share your disgust.

[old man emu]

If heads don't roll as a result of this investigation, then the message is clear to the rest of us - don't bother complying with the Law. All of us are supposed to be equal under the Law. If serious misconduct as exposed by this investigation is not punished firmly, then why should the rest of us subject ourselves to punishment for our misdemeanours? Not that I'm advocating anarchy. The majority of us have the morality to live without doing harm to others.

[spacesailor]

The Rich have Always flouted the Law ! .

They can afford to pay Barristers,  huge sums of money To keep themselves  '  innocent '  .

I wonder IF ! .

King Charles ' had ' a driver's licence, has he surrendered it ? . As he is no longer required to have, a car driver's licence. 

spacesailor

[facthunter]

"No longer required" is different to "Not being Allowed" to have.  Nev

[spacesailor]

Would you keep paying an ASIC bill ' if ' no longer required . ? .

spacesailor