rafa, the boundary between egypt and gaza

[old man emu]

32 minutes ago, Bruce Tuncks said:

I would have hoped that all that stuff died along with hitler etc.

You forget that hatred of Jews is almost a dogma of European Christianity. It is something that is culturally ingrained. Why not in Australia? Probably because to start with the majority of the population was downtrodden so that it didn't matter much whether you were an Anglo, Irish, Jewish, black or brindle. You got got the same end of the pineapple as the person beside you. 

[facthunter]

How can it be that IF you criticise anything Netanyahu says it's ant semitic?. He owes his freedom to this war continuing. Not all Jews like what HE is doing. He's aligned with the Fundamentalists. The extreme right who reckon Palestinians don't exist and other such views. Much of the sympathy the Jews had is gone.  Nev

[old man emu]

1 minute ago, facthunter said:

Much of the sympathy the Jews had is gone.

I am happy to accept the various semitic peoples - Arabs, Turks  and Jews in Australia as long as they declare themselves completely as Australian citizens with no political ties to any other country. My dislike is for the current government of Israel 

[facthunter]

If you migrate don't take your wars with you. Remember WHY you came HERE in the first place. Because it's BETTER than where you left.  Nev

[red750]

You didn't like it THERE

So you came HERE

Don't try to make HERE like THERE

If you don't like HERE the way it is. go back THERE.

[Jerry_Atrick]

I am probably a bit more lefty than most here.. maybe the exception of Marty. I am definitely "woke".. But, I have to admit, I cannot understand the hatred of Jews through the years.. maybe because I was brought up in a household that. apart from the commercialisation of Christmas Day and Easter, was largely brought up in an atheist - or at least non-believing family. It wasn't until I was engaged to a Catholic that IO even knew why Fridays were bog for Fish 'n Chips and hadn't set foot in a chuch.. or even the significance of pancakes. And why there is a lot of cheap wine.

 

One thing I could not understand as a kid, was why Jews were so hated. I had 6 schools in 12 years.. and in each school at different parts of Melbourne , there were many people that openly hated them. Even on these forums, there have been a few (and I stress a few), with apparently little experience direct;y  with them (although one did have, but ignored many others of the complaints he had of them), openly hated them.

 

Religion (including Judaism) has a lot to answer for...

 

But apart from the Palestinian issue, throughout history, what wars, or atrocities have they systemically performed? Yeah, they may think they wre the chosen ones, but I had a discussion with a devout Catholic who was adamant that her friend who converted to Judaism to marry her love picked the wrong religion - not the real one.. so all religions subliminally believe they are the chosen ones (as far as I am concerned).

 

I would love the day where people say, "I couldn't care of your beliefs, I will judge you on your contribution to society, except where there is a bona fide reason why society needs to care for you... " That would be the day himanity saves itself from its own implosion.

 

BTW, Many more Muslims, and others, do respect the country the  have migrated to.. The press are great at highlighting the exceptions, not the rule.. but they portray the exception as the rule.

[Bruce Tuncks]

well Alice Springs was different to melbourne,perhaps because it was a part of sa at the time, but hate of anybody was in short supply, Maybe the blacks provided a target, but if so i was not aware of it. Personally, I would use "repatriation" far more than it is used to rid us of those "immigrants" 'who lack respect and gratitude.

Thinking back, i was supposed to be anti-catholic but it never worked on my generation.

[spacesailor]

Perhaps , !

They were the ' Tax. ' men of the biblical days .

They are always shown as monetary clever people.

Shop-owners . ( not employees ) .

spacesailor

[old man emu]

5 minutes ago, spacesailor said:

They were the ' Tax. ' men of the biblical days .

Only in Judea. In Britain, for example, the tax collectors would have been locals, overseen by governors appointed from Rome.

 

8 minutes ago, spacesailor said:

They are always shown as monetary clever people.

A stereotype, bolstered by Shakespeare's Merchant of Venice and other literary works, even up to the Dickensian Oliver Twist  and Bryce Courtenay's 1995 The Potato Factory. Considering the numbers of Jews throughout Europe, those involved in financing would have been only a very small proportion. Despite Napoleon's most famous remark 'England is a nation of shopkeepers', how many actually were at the time? Not many market stalls set up at Waterloo.

 

The term gnomes of Zurich was used to refer to Swiss bankers who loaned money to governments and businesses, placing those parties in debt. Who has a love for the person they owe money to? If you want to stereotype people as monetarily clever people, take a walk through the Asian and Indian enclaves of Sydney or Melbourne. In my opinion, those people make Jewish financiers look like philanthropists.

[spenaroo]

Jews had both end of the spectrum.

the wealthy well to do bankers and business owners.

but also the poor filling the ghetto's.

 

so they were hated because of the perceived wealth over the natives.

and also hated as they were seen as a lower class....

.... and of course if you are living in the ghetto. then a revolution is a very attractive proposition.

so most of the European revolutions had a large involvement of Jews

[facthunter]

Religions cause a lot of trouble with their intolerance., self righteousness and bigotry. In It's name atrocities are excused., Intolerance of other religions is rampant. Have a good look around you. It's always the fundamentalists who are the most extreme.  IN the US, How do I know?  The BIBLE tells me so. Gimme that old time religion It's good enough for me.

  I like "It aint necessarily so. The THINGS that you're liable to  read in the bible THEY Ain't necessarily SO".  Nev

[old man emu]

"It ain't necessarily so, It ain't necessarily so, The t'ings dat yo' li'ble, To read in de Bible, It ain't necessarily so." The song comes from the Gershwin's' opera Porgy and Bess (1935) where it is sung by the character Sportin' Life, a drug dealer, who expresses his doubt about several statements in the Bible. The song is controversial for casting doubt on the veracity of the Bible in its central lyrics. In Australia,  the song was a major Australian hit in 1965 for singer Normie Rowe, reaching number five on the Australian singles charts. It got Normie into a lot of trouble with the Faithful, but the song has been covered by very many bands and solo artists.

 

A verse was cut solely for the use of an encore. The lyrics were:

Way back in 5000 B.C.
Ole Adam an' Eve had to flee
Sure, dey did dat deed in
De Garden of Eden
But why chasterize you an' me?

[facthunter]

Raises a lot of good questions. .  Paying for the sins of your ancestors?  Hey I've got some good harbour bridges for you You can't see or touch them but just believe and it will all come true. Just tithe 10% of your income. Somehow or other, I can't understand how, HE needs your money. Nev

[old man emu]

I find that there's nothing much wrong with the teachings of Christ. It's the blokes who tried to see more into them and tried to explain their visions who caused the problems.

[facthunter]

I don't recall him encouraging cutting off of heads or stoning People.. Love thine enemies as thyself is preferable to "don't worry about them They are all going to HELL anyhow." of Wahabi Abu Baatar. Basir.. Atheists are particularly despised. How many People did the Born again Christian druggy, GW Bush  cause to be killed?. It's NOT about OIL  He kept assuring us. .Not Much. He called his rockets Crusaders..   Nev 

[Litespeed]

Religion is just a means of control, wealth and war. It always has been and always will be.

 

Religion is a system of indoctrination of an imaginary being one that's all powerful but only works through the deeds of those that believe.

 

It is a system of exceptionalism, hence it's believers or those that claim membership are above all others. The rest are heathens, atheists, apostates or just not on the team. As such they are less human and not worthy of God's love or care nor his worshipped.

 

Given all their doctrines and actions, with countless millions butchered...

 

Religion is the root of Evil

[spacesailor]

IS it the religion,  or the ' crazies ' that control it .

After all it's a " business " first & foremost,  indoctrination is the control agent .

Like insurance , take a punt to see how many years , you can save the $ 1,000

Premium before you ' actually ' need insurance. 

Ask anyone who has died , you will find a new spark to keep living in our 'world .

spacesailor

[facthunter]

IF there was a God, He'd know who all the deceivers are and what they are thinking and they will  get a HOT time. Why would a God resemble US, OR need money?  He must have created the Devil also. . A fallen angel... "God is GREAT "they say, but how did HE get here?. Nev

[spacesailor]

The Christian " GOD " has no shape or form .

And Jesus of Nazareth was not a God, (  according to Wiki ) was a Jewish preacher 

And religious leader .

The Church business is the one needing funds to keep them in the comfort they desire. 

spacesailor

[facthunter]

The Christian faith has a triumvirate. The FATHER (God) The SON (Christ) and the Holy Spirit. We are told..  Just for the record.  Nev

[old man emu]

The concept of the Trinity in the Christian religion is not explicit in the books that constitute the New Testament, it was first formulated as early Christians attempted to understand the relationship between Jesus and God in their scriptural documents and prior traditions. In other words, the Trinity was not revealed by GOd, as were the Commandments, but developed through consideration of earlier things from the Jewish religious writings and from the Gospels and Epistles of the early years of the religion. Those early writings are notorious for mis-translations of the original Aramaic and Ancient Greek and Latin.

 

It is said that Latin is a dead language. In post-medieval times when secular language began to be used, Latin turned to stone and the Latin of the end of the medieval period became the what it is today. That last statement requires a caveat. It was not the structure of Latin grammar that cause misunderstanding. Like so many words in English, meanings changed over time, so that the meaning of a word in 1500 might not be what a writer of Latin meant in the First Century. The first complete Bible in English was published abroad, most likely in Antwerp, in 1535. Myles Coverdale (1488-1569), an Augustinian friar from Yorkshire educated at Cambridge, 'faithfully and truly translated [it] out of Douche [German] and Latin into English'. Just look at the mix of vocabularies behind that translation.

[facthunter]

It's my understanding that Constantine proclaimed the triumvirate as his priests could not agree on the Matter.. Latin is a complete language and stayed with the Churches and spoken by the Monks. My brother was fluent in it as well as some hieroglyphs.  Nev

[red750]

Quite a few years ago, my brother in law and his wife travelled to Italy and visited the Vatican (they were Catholics). They couldn't believe the amount of gold in the Vatican and the beggars outside on the steps.

[Marty_d]

None of it was "revealed by god".  It's all by men to control other men and women.

[Bruce Tuncks]

I've told my personal story about the trinity ever since I helped start Trinity College way back when....  

Apparently it is not explainable to anybody except a believer, and the idea has been a real impediment to selling christianity.

I always thought it was a way to step around the mono vs poly-god idea to have the best of both worlds.