Do we close the Off Topic site Social Australia (.com.au)

[old man emu]

I thanked Octave's explanatory posts because of the explanatory information in them.

 

Here's what I would find to be a negative from moving th FB

 

1 hour ago, red750 said:

Posts on FB are generally no longer than one sentence.

You only have to have been following this thread to see that our discussions require more than one sentence, unless you are adept at constructing  a long and convoluted sentence.

 

Octave has a good handle on FB, but for various reasons some of us don't have a clue. Just a day or so ago I wanted to comment on my son's FB post, but ended up replying to someone else's comment to the same post.

 

29 minutes ago, octave said:

I realise that perhaps most members here are not on FB and perhaps feel uncomfortable about it and that is fine, whatever happens, has to suit the majority. 

The thing we need to be working towards at this early stage is getting the view of the majority. It's a shame that Nev is off the air for whatever reason - hopefully a planned medical procedure. 

 

On 05/09/2024 at 7:35 PM, onetrack said:

There used to be a social forum called The Blokey Shed (www.theblokeyshed.com), it was an offshoot of the Woodworking forum, and was designed to discuss everyday blokes stuff, which wasn't allowed on the Woodworking Forum.

That seems to be what some of us want, or would be happy with. The problem as I see it is how do we enable Ian to meet the costs of sustaining the site. Of course, that problem can only be addressed if we let Ian know that we would like this site maintained, and are willing to chip in.

[red750]

54 minutes ago, octave said:

you can have private groups that can only be seen by members and have no adverts.

I am aware of that, I am a member of a number of them. Memories of the Commercial Bank of Australia Ltd, (for staff of the bank before the merger which created Westpac in 1986), CBA Bank Data Centre Burwood, (staff of the centre in NSW I managed from 1973 to 1978), VMSA Public Notices (Vic Mens Shed Assn blog), Vintage Bonanzas.

 

[Admin]

Firstly like everything else why should just a few pay money to get the benefit when so many others get the benefits for free. The solution to that is every member has to pay to access the site but the outcome of that will be a closed shop that will kill a site off very quickly.

 

If we compare the site versus the facebook points previously made:

FB: Posts on FB are generally no longer than one sentence.

SA: Not only does this site promote longer posts but there is also better formatting of posts like new paragraphs, bold, italic, colour, centering etc, in fact I can add many more if you want

 

FB: Facebook is open to anyone on the planet.

SA: This site is open to anyone in Australia and New Zealand and if any user would like specific friends in another country to be able to access the site, just let me know and I can manually add them

 

FB: You can find the profile of a friend or relative, and select them as a "Facebook Friend". You can search for people you know, and send them a "Friend Request"

SA: You can search for another user and follow them as a Friend basically the same as FB but there are also badges, reputation, etc plus I can add some more user and friend features unlike FB, tell me what you want

 

FB: make you post available to "Public", "Friends", "Specific Friend", "All Friends Except" or "Custom"

SA: Unfortunately FB has it over SA in this area. Not sure what I can do with this

BUT

FB: With items flagged as public, you get inundated with trolls

SA: Moderation is enforced here on SA so Trolls against a user's post is extremely rare

 

FB: People are suggested based on mutual friends, or common things in their profile, such as attended the same high school

SA: Again FB has it over SA in this area. The only thing is you can see a users friends by looking at their profile BUT the thing is, SA has far more privacy and security to prevent unwanted targeting. I could relax this a bit with extra profile fields if we got many more users and friend/family groups were created...let me know how you would like this to go

 

FB: how easy is it to post pictures? Actually, it's quite simple.When in the comment entry panel, an icon (as shown below) opens the Add photos box, where you select the file to upload.

SA: It is much easier to post pictures on SA plus you can also attach different types of files and you do have the Gallery where there are categories

 

FB:  usually short video clips are uploaded in posts and show as a freeze frame. I cannot address Youtube type videos, I've never tried to upload one.

SA: You can link most types of videos including YouTube ones. let me know if there are any you can't. Actually uploading a full video is hard because SA does not have the server space like FB

 

FB: Absolutely littered with adverts. AI monitors your web searches then bombards you with adverts that are barely related.

SA: Not here on SA at all

 

FB: There are complaint groups for things like Australia Post and Foxtel.

SA: We have Groups here that are far superior than FB for users to create, you can even have a Family Group that is locked to just Family users etc

 

FB: A downside for some people may be that on FB people usually use their real name and perhaps some folks value anonymity.

SA: A user can be completely anonymous to every other user but NOT to myself as I value user security to the highest level I can, unlike FB

 

There are many more Pros and Cons of both platforms like cost, easy access, access to many other things etc. I comes down to that I can create just about anything you want here but to do so would need a massive more user registrations to make it viable. For example a "complaint group" as mentioned above is useless if only say 2 users access it or contribute to it.

 

Thanks and I am so appreciative of the comments being made here as a collective.

[willedoo]

I'm all for funding the existing site. It would cost each of us less than a bag of groceries per year. Possibly there's some way of new membership approval to weed out spammers. For that I'd refer to the way FB groups have certain application criteria and waiting periods. The only difference with that is that a member of the public wanting to see what the forum is about can't access it without membership approval. To attract new members there would have to be a site description attractive enough to warrant them going through the approval process. On FB groups it's usually fairly basic - often just a 'tell us about your interests' type of thing. Having said that, most FB groups are very much specific interest groups whereas this forum is a much broader interest platform (how much broader can you get?).

 

I'm a member of a couple of FB groups and personally I think FB is totally unsuitable for what we do here. It's the clunky format that's the problem. The advantage of forums like this is ease of navigation and layout and it can be structured in a much more user friendly way. My vote is a resounding no to FB. I'm a member of a FB ALSE group but only because there's no alternative. We had a Yahoo email group going but Yahoo shut down groups and that disappeared. One of the Brit members started up a forum on his website but that didn't take off for some unknown reason. A Dutch member tried a Teams group but the same story. The Teams format was too clunky. So it was a case of migrate to the FB group by necessity but I wouldn't do it by choice.

[willedoo]

The problem with the FB group I'm a member of is that it's too big. It has thousands of members but probably at least 100 active at any time. It's like having a single thread forum with 100 people posting on it. A smaller, less popular FB group would probably be more user friendly.

[willedoo]

15 minutes ago, Admin said:

Firstly like everything else why should just a few pay money to get the benefit when so many others get the benefits for free.

Another alternative is voluntary donations like the Rec flying site. Then it's a matter of seeing if it's enough to cover costs.

[old man emu]

30 minutes ago, willedoo said:

Another alternative is voluntary donations like the Rec flying site. Then it's a matter of seeing if it's enough to cover costs.

I don't see voluntary donations as an alternative. I see them as the only way to go. This is what Ian said about the cost of maintaining this site: The software per site costs $150 USD per 6 months, that's around $500 a year in AUD, or nearly $10 Australian a week to have this site in just software costs. Hosting costs are basically fixed due to the Recreational Flying site whilst costing a lot more in software costs, I still have to have the hosting costs of around $3,000 a year whether there is 1 site or 10.

 

So we know what the software licence costs, so what is the hosting cost? If there are only two sites running off the licence, this one and Rec Flying, then this one costs $1500 p.a, or $30/week. So if we want to keep this site going, we need a minimum of $40 per week. Divide that by the number of regular users and you get what each user would need to donate.

 

I'd suggest that as part of the registration for newcomers, they be informed of the funding method for the site, with the explanation that if they appreciate what it provides, then they should consider making a regular donation. The important thing in that explanation being that there is no compulsion to donate in order to be a member. Donating is a goodwill thing, except for we site hoggers.

[newsaroundme]

On 05/09/2024 at 2:12 PM, Admin said:

Thank you so much for your input so far, it has opened up many more ideas to consider...I didn't realise, for example, the assistance that a site like this can have on us. Perhaps there is opportunity to steer the site in a more helpful direction instead of just being an Off Topic sister site to Recreational Flying. The following is just a quick brain dump...

 

The domain names TheMensShedOnline.com.au and MensShedOnline.com.au are available

 

@red750 don't suppose you could help in trying to resurrect that old site that we could use?

 

I am looking into how I could lock this site to Just Australian and New Zealand users

 

Do we open the site to say just 10 advertisers at $20 a month? When a user registers there is a message saying No advertising unless they take up this offer OR do we still stop advertising. I don't think a subscription cost is the way to go if we leave the site as it is.

 

How do we get many more new users and friendships?

 

A lot to think about and your help thus far has opened my eyes a bit so thanks for that

Hi, I'm a new user and I have just recommended your forums to someone else. I want to congratulate you on what you do. I can see that this has been hosted for at least 15 years (if not more). If I could I would love to help you. You've done an amazing job. 

[newsaroundme]

I don't know if you've considered this but an account on https://buymeacoffee.com/ might help. It's a great and easy way to get financial support.

[nomadpete]

Having mulled over the issue I have this to say....

(Please do not be offended by my bluntness, I am a bit aspie)

 

Although I highly value the site, I  also value the work Ian has put in over a very long time.

 

Ian, over and above my likes,  what matters most to me is, 'Do you really want to continue the AS site?'

 

If you are not (for any reason) getting satisfaction from your efforts, it's time to stop.

 

From my knowledge of the core forumites, gathered over the years, I am sure we all have come far enough in life to know and accept that any project is only worthy of your effort whilst it is personally rewarding.

 

BTW, the security (and mods) of your platforms would be one of the reasons that we have been able to so openly debate and sometimes reveal very personal things on AS.

 

Thank you.

[octave]

3 minutes ago, nomadpete said:

Do you really want to continue the AS site?'

 

 

This is an important point. Would you be happy to continue running if the forum financially paid for itself?   The cost is one issue but the other is time and effort.  I certainly would understand if you had things you would rather be doing than running a forum for a few old goats.

[spacesailor]

I made a " boo boo ".

So deleted it

spacesailor 

Edited September 7 by spacesailor
Wrong thread

[onetrack]

There's one forgotten factor about FB that virtually all FB users forget - FB tracks you relentlessly - even when you're not logged in. That is the ultimate in devious and treacherous behaviour, and one that keeps my anger fuelled against FB.

What FB also fail to reveal is that they monetise your data - which you give to them for free.

 

Data gathering and data centres are the biggest money spinners in the world today - witness the Bangladeshi/Australian accountant who has just sold out for $23 BILLION, after starting his data centres with virtually nothing, just NINE years ago.

And all that money was made on people letting the likes of FB have free access to all their data. Talk about Robber Barons of the 21st Century!!

 

How to stop FB from tracking you - https://allaboutcookies.org/how-to-turn-off-facebook-tracking#:~:text=FAQBottom line-,What data does Facebook collect%3F,information about your online activity.

 

Australia's newest multi-billionaire built his fortune on data - https://www.watoday.com.au/business/companies/the-new-billionaire-behind-one-of-the-biggest-deals-in-australian-history-20240904-p5k7s9.html

[Jerry_Atrick]

On 05/09/2024 at 5:12 AM, Admin said:

I am looking into how I could lock this site to Just Australian and New Zealand users

Oi! Don't do that! I will be ostracised... ;-) 

 

Can you have sections and threads as per this site on farcebook? Either way, I am with OT, and you can bet your bottom $ it ain't as private as you think.

 

This is a great site and am happy to chip in..

 

 

[red750]

I stand to be corrected by others more knowledgable than I, but I believe another downside of FB is that you cannot go back and look at older posts. They seem to disappear into the ether.

[Admin]

1 hour ago, Jerry_Atrick said:

Oi! Don't do that! I will be ostracised... 😉

 

Can you have sections and threads as per this site on farcebook? Either way, I am with OT, and you can bet your bottom $ it ain't as private as you think.

 

This is a great site and am happy to chip in..

 

 

The registration page would be blocked so existing users are fine and any new members outside of Australia and New Zealand could still be registered by myself manually

[nomadpete]

1 hour ago, Jerry_Atrick said:

Oi! Don't do that! I will be ostracised... 😉

 

 

 

 

No need to be a ostrich, just come home Jerry!

[willedoo]

5 hours ago, red750 said:

I stand to be corrected by others more knowledgable than I, but I believe another downside of FB is that you cannot go back and look at older posts. They seem to disappear into the ether.

FB is awful for that side of it. Posts on FB groups are like ADD; they disappear down the whirlpool one after the other, here today, sucked into the abyss and forgotten tomorrow. I've found some older posts by using terms in the search box, but it's difficult to track things down. I think FB is a terrible format for certain things. Maybe it's ok for small single topic niche groups.

[spacesailor]

Face chat .

It is so good .

For relatives to video chat ,  and so cheap , I wonder why they haven't put a price on it .

spacesailor

 

[willedoo]

3 hours ago, spacesailor said:

Face chat .

It is so good .

For relatives to video chat ,  and so cheap , I wonder why they haven't put a price on it .

spacesailor

 

spacey, another one that's popular for that is Whatsapp. My sister uses it all the time to video chat to family members who live overseas. I use it without video to ring a mate who has bad mobile phone reception.

[Jerry_Atrick]

I use whatsapp for calls, too, but remember, it is owned I thinbk by Meta, who owns FB, so I think the same reason to be weary of provacy should still apply.