What is Wrong with this Pub?

[Jerry_Atrick]

For the next phase in life, I have been looking at businesses, predominantly in the southern NSW Riverina (or northern Victorian area boardering the southern NSW Riverina) area.

 

I am looking predominantly at hospitality businesses to get a feel for the prices. I know if you are looking solely at those advertised for sale, you are likely to pick up a dud. Good businesses go very quick, especially those where the opwner can employ people and still have a decent return.

 

Now, the reason for hospitality is I have a specific marketing vertical in mind; therefore the nature of the hospitality business is important, as is its profile, offering, and proximity to a number of facilities, as well as accessibility options.

 

The reason for the southern NSW Riverina is proximity to what I think is its larger market.

 

In my searches over the last what must be 18 months, this pub has been for sale for all of them: https://www.anybusiness.com.au/listings/mathoura-nsw-2710-accommodation-tourism-hotel-food-hospitality-restaurant-3309521

 

OK, the business isn't what I am after, and it is not quite in the location I need. There is at least one other pub in Mathoura and with a 2021 population of 1,002, it is hardly a big enough town to support one pub, let alone two.

 

For as long as I can remember, the pub has been advertised as a freehold going concern for $400K. That is way below I think would be building value, so I am guessing there is some law or coventant stopping it being converted to something else.

 

But, in the same town, this came up not long ago and is already under offer: https://www.anybusiness.com.au/listings/mathoura-nsw-2710-accommodation-tourism-motel-3414944

.

 

Yeah, I get it is probably having revenue and profitability issues.. but it looks like a pub with the right operator can turn things around. I know since e-commerce, the traffic of salespeople has probably dropped right off, and it is probably not the hottest tourist town in the Riverina.. But surely it looks good to turnaroound - or am I missing something?

 

 

 

 

[pmccarthy]

Some pubs and restaurants are closing here in central Victoria. They can't get staff. People have less disposable income. The once thriving Hepburn Springs is half shut down. Radio Springs hotel, very popular, is closing due to lack of staff. Many businesses have been bought by folks from India who do not know how to run them, and they gradually fade away. Some pubs, like Redesdale, seem to be doing well because they have made a name as a weekend lunch venue. Restaurants in Kyneton are struggling. I don’t know about the border areas.

[old man emu]

I agree with PMC's reason for the closer of businesses in the hospitality industry in rural areas - you can't get staff. Well, you can get get staff to start, but within a few days they are calling to tell you that they can't come today for some reason that many of us would see as trivial. Otherwise they only last for a week or so. I've seen this happen at a pub in my town.

 

The advertisement for the pub mentions access to the Murray River, that's if you want to drive 40 kms. I'd say that Mathoura is another dying small town. Look elsewhere.

[Jerry_Atrick]

Wow.. I would have thought Hepburn Springs and surrounds would be a never ending money spiinner. It is a beautiful part of the world. I recall staying at the Lake House in Daysleford and it was packed and expensive (this was when our then only chold was not even a year old, and staying at my brother's in Melbourne). The accomodation was amazing and of course the setting was gorgeous.. but, I have to be honest, the food and drink, given the cost, was, "meh".

 

We have a similar issue with pubs here, where people who should not be running or in the front of house in a pub buy them, and wonder why they start losign money.

 

I have been thinking of what can be done that the pub in Mathoura. It is not a destination like central Vic and many other areas of Aus. It has some minor tourism from what I can gather. To make it a weekend destination pub would require investment in consructing accommodation. It doesn't have to be fancy, but needs to be good enough to attract the city folk, as does the food. But, apart from a dodgy golf course, not much else on offer there from what I can see.  So, big risks and is the potential reward worth it (I wonder if Stephano Di Pieri would go halves?)

 

As a local, I imagine if the other pub is owned by an established local, it will be impossible to compete with.. but I think putting on good, cold, fresh (i.e. pipes cleaned regularly) beer, and decent pub grub shold go some way..

 

But looking at it, it isn't the profile of place I want, but at that price, it could be worth a crack. I am just trying to see the unique selling point that could be brought to it to make it a goer.

[Jerry_Atrick]

2 minutes ago, old man emu said:

The advertisement for the pub mentions access to the Murray River, that's if you want to drive 40 kms. I'd say that Mathoura is another dying small town. Look elsewhere.

Yes - noticed that.. I think the Edward Rive (more like a creek these days) runs along side it..

 

Yes, a dying town is probably right.. .Will keep the eyes peeled for other opportunities  I think...

 

[old man emu]

The town is on a road to Nowhere. Passing traffic would be minimal.

[facthunter]

It's TOO HOT there., and nothing to do.. All these small towns are DYING. Nev

[spacesailor]

pubs .

The government is killing them , Sydney $ 20 a schooner.  

Drunks can't afford that " must drink " Super cheap plonk .

spacesailor

[Jerry_Atrick]

6 minutes ago, spacesailor said:

Sydney $ 20 a schooner.  

Farq! That is expensive... pints here in  London equivalent to $10 - $12

Edited yesterday at 01:19 AM by Jerry_Atrick

[Marty_d]

Jerry - location, quality, atmosphere. All required for a successful pub.

[facthunter]

It costs more to keep the BEER COLD ,Jerry and it's Bl**dy HOT outside. The town is dying and you'll go down with it.,. That's why it's cheap The wood floor is probably built on the ground also to make it easier for the White Ants.  Give it a Miss. Nev

[facthunter]

Try Portland  (Western Vic) but keep away from the "Sink holes".  Nev

[pmccarthy]

Portland was recently named most affordable town. They have had big closures and a threat hangs over the aluminium smelter, but it is a lovely place if you can handle the wind and cloud.

 

Our local pub is on its second Indian family and gets half a dozen patrons on a good night. They only open on Thursdays to Sundays. One local left his change on the bar and the barman took it.

[rgmwa]

2 minutes ago, facthunter said:

Try Portland  (Western Vic) but keep away from the "Sink holes".  Nev

Ah, my old home town. First permanent settlement in Victoria (1832). Nice place and has a few good pubs.

Alcoa and woodchip exports pretty much keep it going. They were going to close the smelter a few years ago.

[facthunter]

The sink holes are caused by limestone below dissolving in water. It only affects certain areas. Good long coastal walks Historic places Old Buildings  Fresh seafood.. Nothings  THAT expensive. Nev

[Grumpy Old Nasho]

Whichever pub you buy, install 2 or 3 Tesla charging stations, think of the future. Serve the best counter lunches in Australia. Build a sizable beer garden out the back with plenty of shade. Rename the pub to an aboriginal name like: "Tom the Tracker Inn". Write a letter to the Fed Government demanding they increase Australia's national income, and reduce taxes so everyone has more money, and Local Councils have a bit of extra cash to fill pot holes. After doing all that, place a sign saying: "There's gold in (fill in town), you've just got to find it" 

Edited yesterday at 05:34 AM by Grumpy Old Nasho

[nomadpete]

I have seen dieing towns and dieing pubs.... and a few unexpectedly successful pubs in towns that should have been too small to support a corner store.

 

The biggest single element in a successful pub, is the social capability of the bloke/gal behind the bar.

 

Eg, we had a local pub which was known as 'The Toilet Block' - it was an uninspiring bland concrete block rectangle. There were usually the same 4 'customers' leaning quietly against the bar.

 

Then the ex Mayor of Toowoomba bought the pub. She spent a bit putting up a nice enclosed deck facing a river view, and a kitchen. With better staff, better ambiance and good pub food, the place became the place to be and it prospered.

 

Then she sold it. It still has the view, but the staff are disinterested, the food is below average, and the place is now a shadow of its old self. They are going broke.

 

Jerry, do you have the ability to make even the most dullwitted customer feel special? Always welcome, like an old friend? Few people do. But I think that is the most important ingredient in making money from a socially oriented business.

I know I couldn't do it.

[facthunter]

. Near Denny. Any passing traffic will only stop to ask directions out of there or if you sprinkle TACKS on the road just out of town .There are plenty of better locations with multi storied pubs doing badly except when some club books them out then they become overwhelmed and don't have enough staff' It's a dead easy way to go broke. Too labour Intensive. and season dependant. People stay on Main Highways today to get to their destination as quickly as they can. on a tight  time schedule ..  Nev

[pmccarthy]

Here’s a true story from around here. The publican was down on bikers, and generally told them he was booked out for lunch when they arrived. A club of bikie barristers were refused service and so they sorted him out. The next licensee encouraged bikers and has done very well.

[Jerry_Atrick]

I think (and I stress the word, think) I have been through Mathoura once many years ago.. Don't recall stopping, and it would have been on a drive from Echuca to Deni.

 

3 hours ago, nomadpete said:

Jerry, do you have the ability to make even the most dullwitted customer feel special? Always welcome, like an old friend?

Every day I do something like it at work ;-).. Despite my ramblings here, I am reasonably friendly in person to most.

 

I get that quality staff are a difficult thing to procure and even more difficult to retain, especially in more rural areas where younger folk often want to move to bigger centre.

 

And, yeah, I get its hot around there.. Although these days not much hotter than Melbourne, and at least the air is usually drier.  Keeping the beer, wine, and bar temperate is expensive, but the pub seems to be kitted with a decent number of solar panels to at least ameriorate the cost somewhat.

 

Don't get me wrong; I would be vey unlikely to purchase it. I was wondering why the motel sold reasonably quickly and while it was not expensive compared to more popular areas, it commanded a decent price...  Yet the pub, which appears to be kitted out, has the beer garden and in good order can't get a sniff.

 

The profile of hospitality business I am looking for has to be close to some attractions and has to be at a really good price if I have to add accomodation. This isn't too close to decent attractions.

 

But, I was thinking at the right price, it could be a pet project.

Edited yesterday at 09:28 AM by Jerry_Atrick

[Marty_d]

I live near a little town called Margate. (Not the original where you are Jerry!)

 

There was one pub in town, a concrete monstrosity with the entire street frontage taken up by the bottle shop.  All the ambience of an undertakers.

 

Now a brewing family have bought an old wooden hop-drying barn named, appropriately, Hopfields.  They've set it up nicely with an excellent beer garden, live music on Saturday evenings, excellent menu and bags of character.  Unsurprisingly the locals love it and flock to it.  Car park is chockers every weekend and the staff (friendly and efficient) are flat out.

 

https://www.hopfieldsbrewery.com.au/

 

[Grumpy Old Nasho]

The front of that Mathoura "hotel" is bland, dull and boring. I'll bet motorists just breeze past it wondering what it is. It needs to be more attractive with enticements, things that makes you stop and spend a little mula, which can lead to more mula being spent.

[nomadpete]

Something like this?

 

[Jerry_Atrick]

That may work in Deni for the annual ute muster..

 

Maybe the Tattersals needs a "Big Schooner" or "Big Pint" out the front?

 

[nomadpete]

Ok. A big schooner....