Election 2016

[old man emu]

To be fair, my parents were always full of praise for the specialists who came up from Sydney to provide services in Dubbo. The biggest problem is being able to get an appointment. So many patients, so little time.

 

What annoys me is the racket the medical profession has - you can't make an appointment with a specialist without having had one with a GP. I've had several visits and treatments from a plastic surgeon to deal with sun lesions, but I can't just pop in for a consult without bringing a letter from my GP. And, the referral only lasts 12 months. If you have an on-going problem being treated by a specialist who knows your history, you still need to have a GP say, "I think you should see a specialist. $60, please."

 

OME

 

 

[dutchroll]

What annoys me is the racket the medical profession has - you can't make an appointment with a specialist without having had one with a GP. I've had several visits and treatments from a plastic surgeon to deal with sun lesions, but I can't just pop in for a consult without bringing a letter from my GP. And, the referral only lasts 12 months. If you have an on-going problem being treated by a specialist who knows your history, you still need to have a GP say, "I think you should see a specialist. $60, please."

OME

Referrals to specialists are regulated under the Health Insurance Act 1973 and Health Insurance Regulations 1975. They're not a scam concocted by the doctors. They were concocted by the Federal Government so that if you don't have a referral, you do not qualify for a Medicare rebate.

 

To emphasise: You do not need a referral from a GP to see a specialist in Australia. You need a referral from a GP to qualify for a medicare rebate for your specialist consultation, and the rebate will more than cover what you paid the GP, every single time.

 

The history behind referrals is that they are a kind of "triage" system. In the USA there is no requirement at all and people commonly book directly into specialists for treatment of minor ailments, clogging up the specialist's appointment books for things which are totally pointless getting a specialist to treat. Example: they'll book into a Respiratory Physician for a cold. These specialists treat things like mesothelioma, asthma, cystic fibrosis, etc. Not colds. But yes people there actually do this! The healthcare system becomes very expensive and overburdened as a result. So if you want to call it a racket (which I do not believe it is) you should at least call it a Government racket. However the Government do it this way for a reason.

 

You'd be surprised at the amount of correspondence which flows back from specialists to your referring GP about your condition, prognosis, and the recommended treatment. I'm often in bed while my wife is still typing the transcriptions from her dictaphone from the day's consulting.

 

Sun lesions: You could actually go to a skin cancer clinic which is run by GPs. We have quite a good one near where we are which I've been to for example. So why have plastic surgeons do this? Well, it depends a bit on what the problem is. If you had a problem which was near a vital structure (eg your eyes perhaps) or somewhere where you were particularly concerned about scarring (delicate and pretty face perhaps? Is that you? It's certainly not me! ) you might want a referral to a plastic surgeon who has many years of specialist training and additional skills in doing that type of delicate work. But if that's not so important to you, some of the cancer clinics run by GPs are just the ticket, much cheaper, no referral required, and they can very competently and safely remove lesions, etc. You just might not have your delicate lines restored quite as perfectly as they would be by a plastic surgeon. In my case, there are no delicate lines, so it didn't matter and I have to say he did a great job anyway. The last thing they actually want is to be sued or to get a bad reputation, so if your problem is too complex, they would refer you onwards for more specialised treatment. Just a thought......

 

 

[old man emu]

Dutch,

 

There's no need to bring this sort of filth: I'm often in bed while my wife is still typing the transcriptions from her dictaphone , to the conversation.

 

Please don't try to stop us ranting about stereotypes, just because you happen to have experience of reality. Strewth, soon we'll have the partners of lawyers and politicians defending those occupations against our rants. We have to rant about these types who are different from ourselves. We can't find much to rant about the likes of ordinary working people.

 

Besides, while we are ranting about Professionals, we are leaving the Muslims, Chinese, Yanks, Russians etc., alone.

 

OME

 

 

[spacesailor]

A lot of minor surgery has/is done at medical clinics by GP's,

 

spacesailor

 

 

[dutchroll]

OME, on the contrary, I can find plenty to rant about when it comes to ordinary working people!

 

 

[Bruce]

Both my kids were delivered by GP's in the local town. They don't do that anymore, the cost of insurance prohibits it. It was litigation that put up the price of insurance.

 

None of this is the doctor's fault. There is actually a doctor in Adelaide who has a sign "uninsured " on his door, with the address of the nearest insured practice for those who don't like this. Apparently he has no assets.

 

I blame the pollies and the electorate who could change the litigation landscape but they won't. If you could agree not to sue, you could get much cheaper treatment.

 

And if you were so silly as to bring Fred Hollows guys in to do cut-rate cataracts, it will be men with guns from the government who will come to get you. Not men sent by opthalmologists.

 

 

[spacesailor]

It was the "insurance/litigation" that killed the "ZIGZAG" railway at Lithgow. Also the demise of "Australia Wonderland"

 

spacesailor

 

 

[dutchroll]

Apparently he has no assets.

He has no "legal" assets!

 

Litigation against doctors is frequently caused by unrealistic expectations (notwithstanding that there are occasionally some very genuine cases of negligence).

 

You come in after a big accident with your leg smashed into a hundred pieces, The surgeon does their best to patch you up. You forever walk with a very slight limp and can't play touch football anymore. You sue the surgeon for damages because your hundred pieces of leg weren't put back together again in perfect order like you were born with.

 

50 years ago you would've died or been terribly crippled. Today the worst result is that you can't play touch footy. That could be worth a few hundred thousand dollars. It's par for the course in the modern world and it's why medical insurance premiums are so high.

 

 

[Bruce]

I would like to see " agreement not to sue" made more common. It does exist in aviation, as used by the disclaimer form you fill in before a parachute tandem jump, and this has stood the test of at least one court case.

 

I would like to see it extended to medicine. You can already do it a bit by going overseas for your operation. One of the major cost savings of doing that is to escape from the litigation business.

 

 

[bexrbetter]

On the subject of my "free factory" in China, I would rather reply here rather than my build thread.

 

Thanks for understanding.

 

O.K. Just let us know, what the compensation agreements are, that are part of getting this deal??

 

.

 

The local boat builders tried to score an Austral Fisheries boat-building contract. They wanted rent relief from the State Govt, for the area of industrial land they intended to expand onto - a miserable AU$4.9M in rent forgone over 5 years.

 

The State Govt refused. The contract went to Madagascar instead. No wonder we don't make anything here any more.

It is as simple as the opposite of the Australian State Gov's idiocy. And it is unexplainable idiocy, there is no logic to their decision/s at all when it comes to not supporting Oz business.

 

It is as simple as China wants your business, eventually you pay tax, you employ people, you create local micro-economics and there's plenty of old State Factories around.

 

I do have to present a business plan that is analysed by the Gov, we negotiate on it, we make changes, and I have to meet that plan, if not I get shot, errr, charged for the rent.

 

But I assure you that if I don't meet the plan, lets say I achieve 80% of target, I will submit a report, have face to face meetings explaining the circumstances and likely we will still be ok.

 

The stories you see about people going to China for cheap labour is nonsensical, salaries are barely an issue, they come here because they fall over themselves to create the big picture for you to establish your business and continue that support. Could you imagine walking into the ATO and saying "Look, I reckon I'm paying too much tax, what say we lower it please?" ..... and the answer here is; "Ok, how much do you think you can pay, and look, if you're struggling a bit how about you don't pay anything for the next year or 2 or we could organise a loan for you and we will use your tax to pay the interest?".

 

 

[storchy neil]

bex better explain that slower so as the government here might get it neil

 

 

[Pilot Pete]

The Aus government will never get it! I would bet my life on it

 

 

[pylon500]

The Aus government will never get it! I would bet my life on it

If you're waiting for the pension, you already have...

 

 

[onetrack]

That attitude within China is really eye-opening. But then again, many Chinese have always been business people and traders, and they understand the basics.

 

We get idiots for politicians - and State Govt idiocy, best describes their failure to support the local boat builders.

 

EDIT (apologies for my brain-fart error in the boat-building contract - it was Mauritius it went to, not Madagascar. I must have watched one too many Disney movies.

 

Anyway - same area, just the smaller island a bit further out in the El Gran Tiburón Blanco locality.)

 

 

[bexrbetter]

That attitude within China is really eye-opening.

But it's not, it's not eye opening, it's just simple damn logic.

 

It's the Australian Government's attitude that is jaw dropping.

 

 

[spacesailor]

It's going to get worst before they work-out that they are killing the creative minds of this country, the American's did it after the Wright Flyer, & put the flying scene back ten years.

 

spacesailor

 

 

[Marty_d]

Yep... look at what they're doing to the CSIRO. One of the premier science organisations of the world. Without them there'd be no wi-fi fer chrissakes. I think much of the rest of the world is looking at us right now, going "They're firing 300 scientists? Reducing their climate monitoring capability? WTF are these stupid Aussies thinking?"

 

 

[spacesailor]

Well it's over!, now it's time to renege on all the promises they bullshxxxx us with.

 

AS usual !

 

spacesailor

 

 

[Phil Perry]

Yep... look at what they're doing to the CSIRO. One of the premier science organisations of the world. Without them there'd be no wi-fi fer chrissakes. I think much of the rest of the world is looking at us right now, going "They're firing 300 scientists? Reducing their climate monitoring capability? WTF are these stupid Aussies thinking?"

Weeeel, look at it this way mate,. . .if CSIRO hadn't invented WIFI, the Indians or the Poms probably would have,. . ( Bloody clever bods the Poms ) most of the inventions over the lst few decades have been simultaneously claimed by various people in various countries at around the same time,. . it's just down to who got the patent in first, or who was first to put up the dosh for development and get it into the marketplace. . . .

 

I was reading something last year about the bloke who invented the 'Rolls Razor' ( remember them ? ) made a fortune and he financed many other projects put to him by various inventors. He said that one of the biggest mistakes of his life was refusing to back a bloke who showed him Hook and Loop fastener material. He said "I couldn't see any possible industrial or domestic use for that product, now or in the future, so I told him to get lost" and then 'Velcro' was born somewhere else. . .he also mentioned an early version of 'Zip ties' / Cable ties, . . . He didn't invest in them either. . .

 

 

[Phil Perry]

With the leadership election All but over, the United Kingdom Labour Party begins a calm reorganisation of the Parliamentary structure:

 

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[Marty_d]

Weeeel, look at it this way mate,. . .if CSIRO hadn't invented WIFI, the Indians or the Poms probably would have,. . ( Bloody clever bods the Poms ) most of the inventions over the lst few decades have been simultaneously claimed by various people in various countries at around the same time,. . it's just down to who got the patent in first, or who was first to put up the dosh for development and get it into the marketplace. . . .

I was reading something last year about the bloke who invented the 'Rolls Razor' ( remember them ? ) made a fortune and he financed many other projects put to him by various inventors. He said that one of the biggest mistakes of his life was refusing to back a bloke who showed him Hook and Loop fastener material. He said "I couldn't see any possible industrial or domestic use for that product, now or in the future, so I told him to get lost" and then 'Velcro' was born somewhere else. . .he also mentioned an early version of 'Zip ties' / Cable ties, . . . He didn't invest in them either. . .

You're right Phil, someone else would have cracked it sooner or later. But forgetting that one item, the point I was trying to make is that the CSIRO is one of the world's most respected science organisation because they have the quality scientists, some of who have been there for many years. These days good science is more vital than ever, especially in the realm of climate science, so pulling money from such an organisation is so stupid that it seems inconceivable.

 

 

[M61A1]

You're right Phil, someone else would have cracked it sooner or later. But forgetting that one item, the point I was trying to make is that the CSIRO is one of the world's most respected science organisation because they have the quality scientists, some of who have been there for many years. These days good science is more vital than ever, especially in the realm of climate science, so pulling money from such an organisation is so stupid that it seems inconceivable.

While I agree completely about the science thing, they have to foot the welfare bill somehow. Unfortunately if you tell a voter you are going to cut their welfare to pay for some research, guess what's going to happen.

 

 

[Marty_d]

While I agree completely about the science thing, they have to foot the welfare bill somehow. Unfortunately if you tell a voter you are going to cut their welfare to pay for some research, guess what's going to happen.

Why the welfare bill? Negative gearing, superannuation, corporate tax loopholes - there's a shedload of tax not being paid by the top 10% before you start looking at the bottom 10%. Hell, you could even bring in death duties for those Sydney properties where the parents bought them for $50,000 and the kids will sell them for $2 million.

 

 

[bexrbetter]

Why the welfare bill? .

 

Votes.

 

One of the most crippling things in Australia is the pampering to those who rely on welfare at the expense of the middle class who coincidently pay for it.

 

It has become a powerful sub-culture who's swinging vote can be had for as little as a '$200 per child bonus' and similar promises at the expense of real policies and spending.

 

there's a shedload of tax not being paid by the top 10% before you start looking at the bottom 10%.

So what? They spend it, and necessarily pay tax eventually throughout the economy.

 

I can't remember ever not trying to get a better tax return using every avenue, claim and allowance possible, and keeping little chunks of cash to myself - I reckon this comes down to mere jealousy and hypocrisy, nothing more.

 

You can (or could) forgo the tax free threshold, you only have to tick the box, has anyone here ever done that so you intentionally paid tax on the first $18,200 (previously $6,000) dollars "for the good of the Country"?

 

Yeah, thought not. I said hypocrites didn't I, yeah I did.

 

 

[Phil Perry]

Why the welfare bill? Negative gearing, superannuation, corporate tax loopholes - there's a shedload of tax not being paid by the top 10% before you start looking at the bottom 10%. Hell, you could even bring in death duties for those Sydney properties where the parents bought them for $50,000 and the kids will sell them for $2 million.

Are you saying that Australians DON'T have to pay duties on the sale of houses which have increased in value manifold over the years, ?. . .If not, various Governments have missed a good trick there Marty. They certainly do that here in the UK, and have done for a very long time. Any property above £150,000 attracts quite a levy, which is odd, as there is an Uber major property value disparity North to South in this sceptred Isle. . . .

 

My current abode, as an example, bought in 1983 for £13,750, is currently valued at circa £134,000. The same property in the 'Home Counties' ie, the bit surrounding London; attracts a price of up to £500-600,000. Inside the M25 Motorway ring road, in any of the Inner London Boroughs, you're talking around 3/4 Milllion and more. . .Many of these properties were obviously significantly less costly around the time we bought ours, but perhaps around 30% more. .

 

Tthe Govt. makes a fortune on these sales and I am surprised that your Govt. has not latched onto this easy peasy way of making money from nothing. . .we also have a stamp duty to pay on every sale over £150,00 also, I can't remember the percentage offhand, but it IS a significant tax on vendors. . .

 

If they could tax the air we breathe and get away with it, I am sure thy would do just that. I have severely edited this post as I don't wish to vent my spleen as to why they need all this extra largesse. . . . wrong thread.

 

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