Election 2016

[spacesailor]

F T

 

Other countries have nuclear reactors, but built upside down, with the water above, so no need pump water into the reactor in the event the pump stops, IE Chernobyl disaster.

 

 

[Marty_d]

The problem with the Greens is that they are too ignorant of basic science to achieve anything green.For example, they are implacably opposed to nuclear power, which is the only hope the world has to avoid cooking.

 

And they seem to want unlimited immigration to Australia, without any consideration of the carrying capacity.

 

I reckon they should be called the Browns, on account of that's the colour of a cooked and overpopulated landscape.

Actually, I think you'll find most of them are quite science-literate. They want to bypass nuclear because Australia gets enough sunlight, water and wind to more than power our entire nation. The Green's plan is to get to 100% renewable energy - 90% by 2030.

 

Regarding immigration, if you read their policy they don't want unlimited immigration, they want it increased to 50,000 and would redirect the money currently wasted on Nauru and Manus to better assessment and support networks in the region. Our current policy is harming people's mental health to the extent that they're killing themselves to send a cry of help. Dunno about you but I call that bloody un-Australian.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

Mick you should follow your heart and create a smaller gov by taking a redundancy and starting Mick's "Politically Incorrect Spring Water" your motto can be "The Government says it causes cancer but we're still alive".

 

 

[fly_tornado]

F TOther countries have nuclear reactors, but built upside down, with the water above, so no need pump water into the reactor in the event the pump stops, IE Chernobyl disaster.

Its all academic now, it will never get built and solar and wind are closing the gap cost wise

 

 

[spacesailor]

In the event of a largest meteor strike the dust cloud would reduce the solar PV to very poor output,

 

" This cooling was produced due to a 99% reduction in the natural solar radiation reaching the surface of the planet in the first few years, gradually clearing over several decades."(Wikipedia)

 

If severe enough the transport of coal for our power-stations would cease, then we'll be without electricity

 

Hopefully not in the foreseeable future.

 

spacesailor

 

 

[bull]

Actually, I think you'll find most of them are quite science-literate. They want to bypass nuclear because Australia gets enough sunlight, water and wind to more than power our entire nation. The Green's plan is to get to 100% renewable energy - 90% by 2030.

Regarding immigration, if you read their policy they don't want unlimited immigration, they want it increased to 50,000 and would redirect the money currently wasted on Nauru and Manus to better assessment and support networks in the region. Our current policy is harming people's mental health to the extent that they're killing themselves to send a cry of help. Dunno about you but I call that bloody un-Australian.

Hey Marty ,do some research on Australias first wind farm at Esperance in WA the maintenaince and unreliability of the wind and the high costs has made the WA government {who by the way have been paying out huge amounts to make it even part viable ]finally pull the plug on it . No new wind turbines will be supplied and as the ones already there break down they will be taken out of service until the u beaut "green'' only way to go project is gone forever. Check it out mate ,I lived there for several yearsand know several people who worked on this earth saving project and they have told me that it is and has always been plagued with trouble from day one ????biggest wind farm in Australia and it has failed ,so how are you going to make it work mate??????

 

 

[Marty_d]

Hey Marty ,do some research on Australias first wind farm at Esperance in WA the maintenaince and unreliability of the wind and the high costs has made the WA government {who by the way have been paying out huge amounts to make it even part viable ]finally pull the plug on it . No new wind turbines will be supplied and as the ones already there break down they will be taken out of service until the u beaut "green'' only way to go project is gone forever. Check it out mate ,I lived there for several yearsand know several people who worked on this earth saving project and they have told me that it is and has always been plagued with trouble from day one ????biggest wind farm in Australia and it has failed ,so how are you going to make it work mate??????

Coal is dead Bull. Get used to it. Oil is on the way out. We can only use dinosaur juice and f*ck the planet for so long before the cost of dealing with the consequences is far greater than the cost of getting renewables working.

 

Have a look at California if you reckon renewables don't work. Good legislation has made PV mandatory on new homes, required any imported electrical equipment to be more efficient, widespread solar and wind farms. Result? Renewable power is more than 50% which makes non-renewable the minority.

 

The future ain't the Tony Abbott way.

 

 

[Bruce]

The big missing thing in the renewables is storage. There are several ways ( batteries, compressed air, pumping water uphill )

 

but they are all uneconomic.

 

So in South Australia we have the most renewables and also the most expensive electricity and we rely on dirty coal-fired power from Victoria for calm times.

 

I don't like this and actually have shares in a hot-rocks company . The shares are losing value. And I have PV on the roof, but it only provides about 10 percent of out energy.

 

Down at the farm I would like to have built off the grid but I couldn't convince the wife that she could actually survive with a top-opening fridge .

 

And Marty, my friends in California amaze me by how prodigal they are with water and electricity... for example, they have no clothesline and always use an electric drier.

 

 

[storchy neil]

bruce they have no clothesline and the bloody kids have no fun swinging off them:oops: spoil sports

 

how mutch coal power to make 0ne ton of alumiam will solar stand alone power run my big mig welder I would need 5 acres off batteries or give the misses an ear full to get the storm going to spin the turbine :im with stupid:neil

 

 

[fly_tornado]

if your feeling poorly Neil, grab a jug of Mick's Oakey spring water

 

 

[Bruce]

It takes 7 tonne of black coal to give the 14,000 kWh to smelt a tonne of aluminium.

 

That would ignore transmission losses, so the true figure could be double that. I don't know this figure, but I have seen an estimate that more than half of generated power is lost in transmission in general.

 

You might have to increase by 25 percent again if you used brown coal.

 

Say 16 tonne of brown coal ( like in the song " you shovel 16 ton" ) to make a tonne of Al.

 

 

[Marty_d]

Bruce, Tasmania has had hydro-electric power in various forms since 1895. Then in 2005 they hooked us up to the Basslink power cable which joined us to Victoria's grid. When power prices were high late last year, Hydro sold heaps of our nice clean power to Victoria, assuming we'd get lots of rain to replenish the dams. Guess what... we didn't, then the Basslink cable broke so we couldn't even buy their dirty power, so they've been hiring diesel generators at something like $20 mil per month... each... and the state treasurer won't even tell the public how much this little stunt has cost. Now they're talking about adding another cable.

 

Battery technology will improve. With the interest and uptake of electric cars (what was it Tesla have orders for? 180,000 or something?) there's thousands of the best minds working on this because the future of the market is renewables.

 

Meantime look at the solar thermal plants in Spain. Parabolic reflectors concentrate the sunlight to a point at the top of a tower. This drives a generator and molten salt is used as stored energy to continue driving the generator at night.

 

The point is, it's no longer true to say that renewables cannot provide base load or generate enough for industry. They can and they will continue to improve. They're not even prohibitively expensive compared to fossil fuels, when you take into account all the subsidies paid to coal, oil & gas, and they're only going to get cheaper. All we need is the political will to take a lead on this and reposition Australia's focus on the industries of the future rather than those of the past.

 

 

[storchy neil]

bloody hard work that shovelling got a thing here in vic called frount end loader bruce is there a market over your way for them

 

a few years ago a bloke was saying about putting up a wind turbine and facing it to where the wind came from

 

I said you need to put it on a swivel head his wife asked why a swivel head my answer was cause if the wind blows from the opposite direction it will spin the blade the opposite direction and suck the power out of the batteries

 

not thinking any thing of my stupid remark a couple off months latter we caught up I asked how the wind turbine project was going his reply was to expensive to put up two turbines :please:neil

 

 

[M61A1]

Renewable Energy: The Vision And A Dose Of Reality - The Automatic Earth

 

Interesting read....(although written 2012)

 

 

[Jabiru7252]

It does not matter what we use for energy, if we continue to over populate the planet we will suffer terribly. These people who bleat about clean energy, climate change, green house effects etc. are fools because all these things become meaningless when 10 billion people are fighting for the last scrap of food and water and land. I personally don't care because I'll be long dead when the sh*t really hits the fan. It's YOUR kids and grand kids that will suffer.

 

 

[Marty_d]

Renewable Energy: The Vision And A Dose Of Reality - The Automatic Earth

Interesting read....(although written 2012)

It is an interesting read and a sobering one. However before all the green-haters get too excited about it, you may want to realize that she's not endorsing dirty alternatives - she's basically saying that there's going to be a lot less power available in the future, regardless of the source.

 

Way I think of it is, if you don't care about a future for your kids and grandkids, then yep, support the status quo, pay subsidies to the fossil fuel producers, use as much energy as you can afford and damn the consequences.

 

If you do care, then we should be looking at ways to transition to renewables. This may mean disruptions to economies, politics, and industry. No one said it was going to be easy, if it was we would have done it already.

 

Doing nothing is just fiddling while Rome burns.

 

 

[Jabiru7252]

About 100 years ago somebody did the maths and suggested to quite an accuracy that about 2 billion is a sustainable population. That is, 2 billion can live without worrying about their pollution because the planet can keep up with repairing the damage 2 billion create or healing itself as some say. Computer modelling suggests much the same even with coal fuels. 2 billion. Some suggest that 50 billion people living in tepees will work, but who wants to live in a tepee? With the over population problem and the rise of Islam (who want to return to Biblical times) I believe that human kind will in fact be living as the primitives did 30 thousand years ago all within the next 100 years. Again, I don't care, I'll be long dead and forgotten. And just to be sure, I am part greenie.

 

 

[M61A1]

It is an interesting read and a sobering one. However before all the green-haters get too excited about it, you may want to realize that she's not endorsing dirty alternatives - she's basically saying that there's going to be a lot less power available in the future, regardless of the source.

Way I think of it is, if you don't care about a future for your kids and grandkids, then yep, support the status quo, pay subsidies to the fossil fuel producers, use as much energy as you can afford and damn the consequences.

 

If you do care, then we should be looking at ways to transition to renewables. This may mean disruptions to economies, politics, and industry. No one said it was going to be easy, if it was we would have done it already.

 

Doing nothing is just fiddling while Rome burns.

Yes, I understand that the author isn't endorsing dirty alternatives, but I pretty much stand along with the article. I just want any govt involvement to be well thought out and useful, not just a careless, "throw money at it", type of approach. I love the idea of renewable energy and alternates to fossil fuel, but a lot of development is required, and our "green" politicians are a bunch of idiots. Sometimes, doing nothing for a while, is better than acting rashly.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=1190203794332140

[Jabiru7252]

over population issue again. Less people, less requirement to dam rivers.

 

 

[dutchroll]

Sometimes, doing nothing for a while, is better than acting rashly.

You have to be careful to distinguish between politicians who want to do "nothing for a while", and who want to do nothing "ever".

 

For example, when they say "it's a load of crap, I don't believe it" such as Abbott did, you can confidently say they fall into the latter category.

 

What sh*ts me is when people pretend they are advocating "caution" and "avoiding hasty decisions", yet clearly have no intention at all of advocating any action whatsoever. In other words they are lying about their motives.

 

 

[M61A1]

You have to be careful to distinguish between politicians who want to do "nothing for a while", and who want to do nothing "ever".

For example, when they say "it's a load of crap, I don't believe it" such as Abbott did, you can confidently say they fall into the latter category.

 

What sh*ts me is when people pretend they are advocating "caution" and "avoiding hasty decisions", yet clearly have no intention at all of advocating any action whatsoever. In other words they are lying about their motives.

I see that in Turnbull. Doing FA except what it takes to remain in power. Unfortunately I see the other options as worse as things stand currently. The problem is that if any of the pollies has the balls to make some tough decisions, they will be removed by the public at the very next election ( aided and abetted by our hysterical media) , and achieve nothing. I think someone mentioned this in a previous post.

 

But as far as renewable energy, yes, more needs to be done, but not willy nilly, it needs to be a well thought out, scientifically effective solution, not just throw buckets of money at every crazy idea. So I would rather that they proceed with caution on that one.

 

 

[Marty_d]

I see that in Turnbull. Doing FA except what it takes to remain in power. Unfortunately I see the other options as worse as things stand currently. The problem is that if any of the pollies has the balls to make some tough decisions, they will be removed by the public at the very next election ( aided and abetted by our hysterical media) , and achieve nothing. I think someone mentioned this in a previous post.But as far as renewable energy, yes, more needs to be done, but not willy nilly, it needs to be a well thought out, scientifically effective solution, not just throw buckets of money at every crazy idea. So I would rather that they proceed with caution on that one.

Turnbull has been taught a severe lesson about doing what it takes. When he rolled Abbott and most of the population gave a sigh of relief, he perhaps should have realised that his popularity (apart from NOT being Abbott) was due to his progressive views things like climate change and same sex marriage, and his ability to string together more than 3 words in a row.

 

If he had've stuck to his guns and shown some leadership he could have brought the progressive side of the LNP along with him, and right now he'd have the same approval rating he had then. Instead he's tried to consolidate his position as leader by pandering to the conservatives and doing precisely nothing of any value. Climate change? Continue to throw money at the polluters. Same sex marriage? Do the same as Abbott did and leave it to a non-binding, $100m plebiscite. 3 word slogans? Back every time he opens his mouth.

 

Politics is always compromise but the Malcolm Turnbull today is unrecognisable as the Malcolm Turnbull of a year ago.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

'The Cattle Duffer': Insiders wraps up Barnaby Joyce's eventful week

[dutchroll]

I see that in Turnbull. Doing FA except what it takes to remain in power.

Yes, like many others, I saw Turnbull as a moderate compared to TA's more hardcore conservative stance, so I held high hopes for him (I don't really care much whether moderate lefties or moderate righties are in power - just as long as they don't swing wildly to their respective "far side").

 

Regrettably I agree that he's done little. I do think he has been held captive by some factions in the LNP but I've run out of excuses for his ineffectiveness now.