Silly Picture Thread.

octave · March 16

18 minutes ago, nomadpete said:

Octave, just try making a complaint against a woman (for any reason).

I don't recall having a reason to complain about anyone really, perhaps I just keep better company. Anywhere I have worked I have generally been like and respected. I can't think of any reason I would have had to complain.

19 minutes ago, nomadpete said:

I share the view that you have been very fortunate to mix/work amongst the nice people.

I don't know if it is luck.

My first workplace was in the RAAF as a musician. When I joined it was male-only because of stupid crusty old conservatives. A couple of years later the first two women joined. For the most part, the smarter men were very accepting. There was a small group of insecure men who I guess thought their sacred space was being invaded. The worst occasion was when this group of male man boys organised to keep using the only toilet during break to prevent the women from using them. These women put up with this and actually went to the neighbouring units toilets. This eventually came to a head when one of the women dared to complain to the boss. The boss was furious and rightly had a go at these insecure idiots. I can remember after one of the ring leaders shouting in the woman's face "This is a mans airforce" I cleary remember the verbal savagery and the flecks of saliva flying out of this man's mouth. Of course, this was many years ago and these people are now reasonably friendly and the man I think is embarrassed.

On another occasion, we were doing a parade rehearsal at ADFA in Canberra. Somebody (one of the officer cadets) dropped a tampon dipped in red paint just behind a female cadet. This kind of behaviour was rife back then and the victims did not feel they could complain. I believe later there was a scandal at ADFA where a cadet put a camera in the women's bathroom https://www.couriermail.com.au/ipad/defence-cadet-filmed-female-in-shower/news-story/7aca343b1ff5f785337f7febf81072e8

As a music teacher, I would be alone in a small room with a student. This was never a problem, I always behaved professionally. Over 30 years of teaching I am only aware of 2 instances of allegations made against teachers I worked with and they were wholly justified.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2009-09-03/teacher-tells-court-student-was-of-consensual-age/1415866

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2008-08-21/music-teacher-was-obsessed-with-child-porn-court/484678

I worked with both of these creeps.

If you ask pretty much any woman they are likely to have stories about poor treatment. Things that they just are expected to put up with.

I have related this story before. My wife joined a veterans table tennis club. There was an old guy there who was a good player and was giving advice but gradually started becoming a bit handsy. My wife started to dress in more baggy clothing so as not to encourage him. Eventually she brought it to the attention of the president. The vibe she got was, "don't make a fuss because he is a long-standing member and it will embarrass him". She left this club and went to another nearby club. At this club after a session the president asked to speak to the members, the males and females seperately. It turns out that a complaint had been made (not by the woman involved, she was just going to leave) but by a decent and brave man who had observed this and realised that the woman was embarrassed and upset. My wife gave up on activities where there were many older men. My wife spent many years working in an all-male environment and the men there were great. You guys would probably think my wife is an uppity woman.

Standing with a 12-year-old student outside a music studio where she had just completed an exam a car drove past with a group of young men and one of them shouted "f*** her mate, I did." This kind of stuff still happens sometimes. In my wife case she resented the fact that it seemed to be her who had to carefully monitor her behaviour in order to not send the wrong signal (she was asking for it). It was also her responsibility to not hurt the man's feelings. I am sure most women can relate to this. Be pleasant so as not to be a stuck up b1tch but not do anything to suggest that she is interested in anything more.

My objection to the video is because it presents women as the problem and men as the innocent victims. The truth is that there are some men and women who behave badly. In the case of my wife and table tennis she had to make the sacrifice and quit.

The notion that I have been merely lucky by not having a girl or woman make a complaint against me doesn't really make sense. 32 years of being alone with a student and no a single complaint, this to me is not luck but professionalism. Other than the 2 teachers that I linked to I don't believe I know of a colleague that has had an allegation made against them. Sometimes myths build up that are greatly skewed from reality.

Things have changed and I would say generally for the better. When I was in the RAAF if I had had a daughter I think I would have discouraged her from joining.

nomadpete · March 16

2 hours ago, octave said:

perhaps I just keep better company.

I am sure you do.

However, a long time ago I personally experienced an event of violence by my partner. I attempted to deflect all blows without harming her in any way. At the time and the police said "There is a lot more of this than the public know. If you wish to make a complaint (to the police, initiating possible prosecution), expect the have a difficult time proving anything."

Is that a bias?

My partner was supported by colleagues who stated such as 'Oh she is a nice person, she would never do anything like that '.

Is that a bias?

I was subjected to over three hours of physical assault at the time, and later spent the night in Royal Brisbane casualty.

When she was interviewed at a police station a passer by (happened to be senior police person, and a neighbour) asked 'Why are you here?' To which she replied, in tears 'I don't know why'.

She was sent home. No charges were laid.

is that a bias?

In my workplace, one male said 'Why didn't you just king hit her to stop it?'. Yeah that fits the stereotype. But I would not hit a woman.

Is that a bias?

Ironically several others quietly came out to say they too had been physically assaulted by wives, but didn't say anything because nobody will believe it. And they would be seen as weak. These men do not show up on anybody's statistics.

Is that a bias?

I knew at the time that any attempt to defend myself would certainly result in an instant DVO, no questions asked.

Is that a bias?

Years prior to that psychological disaster, and probably contributing to it, my wife of 20 years had attempted to stab me with a kitchen knife when I presented her with a envelope filled with written love letters from another man. The woman I loved vowed to kill me whilst I slept. But that is another long story. But I later slept in a separate room with a chair wedged under the door handle, until I left. I left with nothing except my sanity (and my life) and built a better life. But that is another story.

But these are two stories of cases where women received greatly beneficial treatment due to bias toward women.

Edited March 16 by nomadpete

Admin · March 16

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-wales-47252756

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-54237409

nomadpete · March 16

I know we have drifted away from funny pictures but it is important.

"Michael Dix-Williams, project manager, said: "There's very much a belief that domestic abuse only happens to women, and that prevents men coming forward."

This alone has caused innumerable suicides of men. I was almost one.

I do not trivialise nor justify any violence toward women. I just ask equal voice to the cases of violence BY women.

Edited March 16 by nomadpete

octave · March 16

8 minutes ago, nomadpete said:

"There is a lot more of this than the public know. If you wish to make a complaint (to the police, initiating possible prosecution), expect the have a difficult time proving anything."

Domestic violence perpetrated on anyone regardless of gender is terrible. The notion that women have an easy time reporting domestic violence or sexual violence I think is probably exaggerated. Certainly when female-on-male domestic violence occurs men are reluctant to report it. There are many biases and assumptions. People will say "If he or she hits you then why don't you leave" without considering the difficulties of that.

The post I was reacting to was not actually about domestic violence but about men supposedly not wanting to work with women because they may be accused of something, that is what I am reacting to. I also call into question how strong feeling is amongst men. I have been looking at the research.

27% of men avoid one-on-one meetings with female co-workers. Yep, that’s right, almost a third of men are terrified to be alone in a room with a woman.

or to put it another way 73% express no such reluctance.

21% of men said they would be reluctant to hire women for a job that would require close interaction (such as business travel).

or 79% of men don't see a problem with this

19% of men would be reluctant to hire an attractive woman.

or we could say that 81% of men would not be reluctant

The 2018 survey results found that more than 10% of men and women said they expected to be less willing than before to hire attractive women.

or put another way around about 90% did not think this.

old man emu · March 16

My opinion is being changed by my observation of an attitude that seems to have arisen in the Millennial generation (1981 - 2005) which makes them self-centred and ready to label anything that is not bolstering their egos as a savage attack. The latest crap is this non-binary "my pronoun". Misgender someone by using the age old pronouns of English and you can end up in deep doo-doo.

I don't care what a person wants to adopt as a sexuality, as long as the expressions of their sexuality does not become the dominant way they exist in Society. To me it is more important what they contribute to the Common Good of society than the type of relationships they wish to foster privately.

nomadpete · March 16

1 minute ago, octave said:

The notion that women have an easy time reporting domestic violence or sexual violence I think is probably exaggerated.

Just taking that point.

I disagree. All a female has to do is report an allegation to the police and ask for a DVO. No questions are asked. It can be misused (and frequently is).

I abhore ALL violence.

However I was poweless to intervene or gain support when I was assaulted.

That is clearly gender bias.

octave · March 16

Nomad, I am not sure where in my original post in response to the video I went into the subject of domestic violence. I was responding specifically to the video about men not wanting to work with women which I believe is exaggerated.

red750 · March 16

In order for this thread to return to Silly Pictures, I am creating a new topic for Domestic Violence. I have started the topic, but it may be half an hour or so before I submit it.

Jerry_Atrick · March 16

@mods, maybe move the above posts to the new thread if possible?

Edited March 16 by Jerry_Atrick

ClintonB · March 16

ClintonB · March 16

ClintonB · March 16

old man emu · March 16

18 hours ago, octave said:

Do you have problems in your relations with women?

Not now that I am wary that anything I say can be misconstrued to be aggressive either sexually or mentally.

Years of attending to domestic disputes, and being forced by those running Domestic Violence Units to always take the woman's side in a situation of He said/She said colours your perceptions. Also the constant examples of women making claims of historical offences which cannot be substantiated with independent evidence add to this perception.

Women are being taught to use allegations of sexual assault as a means to an end. I recall being told by a school maintenance man that he once was telling off some young female students who were doing something when the leader of the group told him that she would tear her blouse and make a complaint that he had tried to touch her boobs. He said he downed tools and walked into the Principal's office to quit on the spot. If such a complaint had been made, how could he prove it false when the leader would coerce the rest of the group to back her story?

Consider the dark concept behind this little bit of comedy

octave · March 16

3 minutes ago, old man emu said:

Women are being taught to use allegations of sexual assault as a means to an end.

This does not represent the women in my life does it represent the women in your life? My wife received nothing for complaining about being groped at table tennis and ultimately gave up doing something she loved. Of course not every allegation has merit but the notion that men are wonderful and it is evil women causing all the trouble doesn't stand up. The woman who went jogging in Ballarat and was killed is not an isolated event.

As I have said I spent 30 years in tiny teaching rooms with people of all ages but mainly young girls and boys. I have never even had the hint of an allegation. I also co-managed a music school and other than the teacher caught with child porn (of the most hideous kind) never a problem. I suspect the overblown fear of being subject to an allegation has more to do with a backlash over changing social ways of interacting. It was suggested that my lack of problems in this area was due to luck. I would suggest it is due to understanding what is acceptable and what is unacceptable.

I am definitely not saying men bad women good. I did present many examples of bad behaviour I have witnessed but often these things are justified as a joke or he doesn't mean to be groppy. The "you can grab them by the pussy and they cant stop you" thing is a belief I have come accross before

I find it quite sad that this forum is only populated by older men but perhaps that is the way people here prefer it. Personally, I am looking for a forum that is a little more varied.