greens are

[Bruce]

Yes Old K. Under certain chemical situations ( anaerobic) stainless steel rusts as fast as anything.

 

I actually knew this from a marine situation where molluscs caused rapid rusting of stainless steel.bands. Also stainless steel has failed in evap-air-conditioner sumps .

 

Apparently the same happened to the bore-casings for the hot rocks. We need an affordable high-temperature material to make these casings.

 

Bugger huh.

 

 

[Yenn]

Sen Canavan has said that his mother got him Italian citizenship, without telling him and that he was 25 years old at the time.

 

I wonder how Italy can accept a request for citizenship for a 25 year old, without a signature on the application.

 

It does point up the ridiculous situation where Australia lets just about anyone become an Australian and also keep some other nationality. We have Israelis getting our citizenship and the main reason is so that they can go anywhere in the world, whereas their Israeli passport would disallow them from a lot of countries. they can also come here when they have caused the Arabs to attack Israel.

 

There are thousands of dual citizens living overseas in their country of birth with the safety net of Australia coming to get them when their own country gets too dangerous.

 

I believe dual citizenship should be banned and would love to hear anyones argument against it.

 

 

[Bruce]

You have a point about dual citizenship Yenn, but the safety net is not that good.

 

Once I went to the Australian embassy in Rome. The place was full of elderly couple tourists who had lost all their money and passports etc. The thieves grabbed her shoulder bag ( ripping off the strap) and hopped onto a waiting motorbike, which weaved away into the traffic. With Australians and Americans the wife has all the stuff in her shoulder-strap bag.

 

Well the embassy was letting them make one phone call home. I have no idea what happened if this call didn't get money sent.

 

 

[octave]

I believe dual citizenship should be banned and would love to hear anyones argument against it.

I have no strong feelings either way on this. I am one of those duplicitous dual citizens (as far as I know). I have no plans to stand for federal parliament (I understand that this requirement does not apply state Parliament). I do accept that the law as it applies today says that these (and probably many more to come) were ineligible to stand at the time. the law is the law whether it is sensible or not. I don't see it as sensible because it just does not make sense to me. Surely any one who was born of Australian parents in another country and returned before the age of 1 is not out to favour the country of their birth over Australia and if they were I would imagine they would have made sure they did the renouncing thing so they could legally carry out their evil plan. I was listening to the radio today and I must admit that to my ear it is a little distasteful when a list was read out, "senator so and so apparently their mother was born in x country". it did start to sound a little xenophobic to me.

 

The absurdity is that renouncing former citizenship relies upon the government of the country you are renouncing. Perhaps a North Korean may renounce but that may mean nothing to the NK government perhaps they would not accept it..

 

It seems even more absurd when this involves Commonwealth countries. Although I guess I would be a dual citizen when I joined the RAAF I did pledge allegiance to Queen Elizabeth of Australia, her heirs and successors (I guess thereby renouncing my allegiance to Queen Elizabeth of great Brittian).

 

To me it a is a clearly ridiculous part of the Constitution and should be changed at the next referendum (as it has been in many other countries)

 

My son was born in Australia but a few years ago moved his successful business to New Zealand. He bought a house in NZ and intends to live there for the foreseeable future. As an Aussie in NZ he can fully participate in elections and he is slightly politically active. I am wondering what his status is he Aussie? is he a Kiwi?, I understand because both his parents are British he could apply for a UK passport. What is he? Could he stand for Parliament anywhere?

 

I personally have no problem with abolishing dual citizenship but I am not sure how that would work. I don't feel like I have dual citizenship, I don't have any documents to say I am not a British subject but Australia is the only country I know and I did pledge allegence when I became a citizen (at the age of 7) I have no memory or allegiance to the UK, I have served in the military and sworn allegiance to this country, I feel that should be enough I just don't feel I should be called upon to prove that "there is no one else, just you"

 

I also have a problem with the amount of time wasted on this trivial issue. The notion that we have a practical problem with pollies manipulating Parliament to favour the country that they left as a child is plainly nonsence.

 

Why not just change the constituion to say "must pledge allegence to" and "renounce any other allegences" This present situation is farsical and will wastfully occupy the parliament for sometime to come and will cause resignations an all sides.

 

 

[octave]

From a couple of people I know, they have dual citizenship so they can claim pensions from both countries.

 

I do not know about other countries but I cannot claim British pension My parents can and this is not well understood by some people. The facts are my parents get a part pension from Britain, not as a benefit but a pension system that they paid money into from their wage, it is not a benefit as such but more like super, would you pay into a retirement system and then abandon it?

 

And more importantly the money they get from their British pension is offset by a reduction of the Australian pension, it is treated like any other income. when the British pound goes up in value their pension is reduced.

 

Overseas pensions are not a free lunch.

 

Example 2: John is a single agreement age pensioner, in Australia, who receives a foreign pension of $200 per fortnight from Portugal. He has no other income, and his assets are below the assets value limit.

 

The amount of age pension that John will receive is calculated as follows:

 

Maximum singles rate $888.30

 

less foreign pension $200.00

 

Equals: Amount of fortnightly pension $688.30

 

For more information about assessment of foreign pensions from these countries contact Centrelink International Services on Ph: 131 673 or on the website: International Services - Australian Government Department of Human Services

 

 

[Marty_d]

Hey Storchy Neil, apparently Malcolm Roberts is in the spotlight too and it looks like he may have been a dual citizen when he was elected.

 

Since you started this thread about the Greens, I wonder if you have the same opinion that Malcolm Roberts should leave parliament too?

 

 

[willedoo]

They're already talking about Pauline's sister taking his spot if he bombs out. There could be a lot of red hair in the Senate.

 

 

[pmccarthy]

The North Koreans could grant automatic citizenship to all Australians. That would really stuff us up.

 

 

[storchy neil]

marty d as I said the law was written abide by it as i stated I knew about it why did they not sheet it pays not to educated neil

 

 

[kgwilson]

Getting pensions from other countries has nothing to do with citizenship. I am not an Australian citizen but applied for a pension because Australia, UK & NZ have a reciprocal agreement. I get a NZ pension (called National Superannuation over there) but to get it I had to apply for an Australian Pension as I live here. Once the process began & I had to divulge every country I'd ever lived in & when. I suddenly found that I was eligible for a UK pension as I worked there for a year in 1973/74 & had a National Insurance number. All this was to make sure Australia had to pay me the least.

 

I now get a NZ pension, & a (small) UK pension as these are not means tested & get nothing from Australia as my assets and income (income includes foreign pensions) are above the threshold. My wife is an Australian Citizen & gets a NZ pension & nothing from Australia. The reciprocal agreement seems to work well for Australia at the expense of the other partners.

 

 

[facthunter]

Well we are the CLEVER country you know. When you hear these thing it pays to take into account WHO made the statement asserting we are clever. I see little evidence of it especially coming out of Canberra from the elected elite. IF they are the best, dog help the rest.

 

The brits give their Australian expat's a poor deal . Worse than many other COLONIES. The Brit pension is not means tested. Everyone gets it. We are still considered descendants of felons, by some Poms. WE paid 10 Quid to get some to come after the war, (WW2) and some proved their foolishness by going back after we had paid an overpriced amount for them. (Two weeks wages at least) . Here if you don't have convicts or highwaymen in your ancestry you are considered inferior and lacking in inherited character? That's one of my problems . They chose to come here (both sides) from Northern England.. and paid full fare in the middle 1800's. How silly you could have pinched something and got a free trip to what was supposed to be a penal colony at the end of the earth. Became much better than the place they left . (some would think). Nev

 

 

[storchy neil]

yeh nev bit like me pommy mate running around looking to borrow 2 shillings for his fare back to pommy land gave him a quid here take nine others with you

 

on the other hand have 10 pound poms that have been life long mates for over 55 years and done well for them selves neil

 

 

[Yenn]

I heard a bloke on Maccas this morning. Born in UK and came with his ten pound pom parents at a very young age. Served in Aussie military and is a reservist. Worked in a government job and then when he got a job overseas he had to get a British passport as it would have taken too long to get an Aussie one.

 

You would think that being in our military would automaticly qualify you for citizenship.

 

 

[facthunter]

You would think anyone in the military would already have their country's passport. Nev

 

 

[octave]

You would think that being in our military would automaticly qualify you for citizenship.

You have to be a citizen to join or be eligible to become a citizen and do so within 12 months

 

 

[storchy neil]

yes to the last part neil

 

 

[storchy neil]

red what about the story of that brain dead uni idiot wanting to make people shorter so as they believe in climate change

 

desperate and they say I'm an idiot neil

 

 

[pmccarthy]

What? They want to Shorten people? I think we all may get Shortened if the Libs don't wake up.

 

 

[Bruce]

Storchy, I can understand you being annoyed with the sort of posturing that we see from labor or the greens, who make noises about climate change but do nothing effective, but climate change itself is beyond dispute. The climate is quite unstable and has changed in the past from natural CO2. This time the CO2 is from man-made sources.

 

 

 

[facthunter]

I'm wondering what papers some here read. They are all pretty BAD but some are badderer than others.

 

Red, the Queen is the monarch of all her dominions and is automatically a citizen+. Doesn't need a passport. Magic stuff isn't it? Remember when they went into the EU. Unilaterally dropped all trade deals with Australia. No apples butter and I don't know what else went there Nev

 

 

[Bruce]

Well I went there and had to wait for hours at Heathrow in the slow aliens queue along with other undesirables who wore turbans or bones in their noses, while greeks etc went right in through a different gate. I would like to sentence every monarchist in Australia to do the same thing.

 

 

[willedoo]

I'm wondering what papers some here read. They are all pretty BAD but some are badderer than others.Red, the Queen is the monarch of all her dominions and is automatically a citizen+. Doesn't need a passport. Magic stuff isn't it? Remember when they went into the EU. Unilaterally dropped all trade deals with Australia. No apples butter and I don't know what else went there Nev

The Queen is the Queen of Australia, ie: she is the monarch and not a subject or citizen. If she was a subject or citizen, she could not be the Queen.

 

She doesn't have a passport and doesn't have the right to vote. She is not a citizen of Australia, New Zealand, Canada or the U.K., or anywhere for that matter. She wears different hats. Her role as Queen of the U.K. has no bearing on the separate role of Queen of Australia.

 

 

[nomadpete]

I'm confused. More than before.

 

Tell me again. Why do we want a queen?

 

AND three levels of government?

 

 

[Marty_d]

Annabel Crabb has a humorous (as usual) look at the whole issue...

 

Annabel Crabb: Someone has switched Section 44 to 'evil'

 

 

[willedoo]

I'm confused. More than before.Tell me again. Why do we want a queen?

 

AND three levels of government?

Why do we want a queen? A lot of us don't. But a constitutional monarchy is one of the most stable and workable systems of government in the world.

 

The other options are military dictatorships, communist states or republics. I'd be interested to hear people's views as to which republic models are better than our system.

 

Why do we want three levels of government? For a start we have to have two because Australia is a federation of sovereign states. There is no federal Australia as a single entity . It doesn't relate to actual real estate. The Commonwealth of Australia is a paperwork entity to bring together a group of sovereign states as a commonwealth, federation, or confederation depending on preferred words. Like it or not, that's legally what we are, warts and all. The only way to change it is by referendum. And if it passed, then the majority don't want a queen or three levels of government. If it fails, then the majority want a Queen. Truth is, most people who are monarchists just want the political system. Most couldn't give two hoots about the actual person in that role.

 

Local government, as much as it is a pain in the a*se at times, is important for the de-centralization of power. The States serve that role as well. If we had one federal government and no states or local government, would Malcolm and his boffins give a sh*t about the people of Derby, Winton, Cunnamulla or Hall's Creek. I have my doubts about that. Centralizing all power in such a large and remote land mass could be a very bad experiment.

 

At the moment, my opinion is that we have a better system than most republics I can think of. We have the Westminster system MK.2 which is better even than the British system, as our upper house members can be ordinary citizens and not have to be lords. If this was the U.K., we'd have Lord Pauline and Lord Derryn.