the postal vote/survey/plebisite

[Geoff13]

Re the MAN/ WOMAN requirement in the marriage act, that's one of HOWARD's edicts. That requirement was inserted in the last 20 years. Prior to that it was "TWO persons". Nev

That is part of my problem with the whole thing.

 

They didn't ask us if they should put those words in did they.

 

So why ask now if they should be removed.

 

Just stand up do what you are getting paid for and make a decision.

 

Allow a conscience vote, give the pollies time to go talk to their electorates and then vote on it.

 

Why the hell are we going on about it, the vote should have been had years ago and it would be over.

 

The reason those words were inserted was to stop gay couples marrying, so until 20 years ago it was legal just had never been challenged.

 

Like I say they didn't ask to change it before, so why ask now?

 

 

[facthunter]

Geoff It suited them THEN but doesn't suit them now. They have politicised it The Plebiscite was a stalling tactic. Not done in good faith. Saying most people are NOT talking to us about this. Hasn't worked. It's hurting the LNP In this matter public attitudes are changing quite quickly. Nev

 

 

[spacesailor]

I think I'll have to put a no vote in:

 

Only because every time there's a new thing from the polie's, it hurts my pocket!.

 

GST / driving license green card / the learners red,green & blue L plates / the Gun buy-back (only legal guns it seems), you'll think of more.

 

spacesailor

 

 

[Marty_d]

Well, the only way a "yes" vote will cost you is if you then go get married to another bloke.

 

Whereas if it gets voted down, all the people who want it aren't going to go away - you'll have another costly plebiscite / postal vote / god knows what in about 3 years.

 

 

[Yenn]

Twenty years ago I didn't see any same sex marriages, nor 30 or 40 or 50 years ago. In those days marriage was between a man and a woman. Then at some time the Gays decided they wanted to get " Married" I don't know what they can have being married that they can't have legally as a same sex couple.

 

There seems to me to be push to promote same sex relationships and anyone who doesn't go along with this is labelled homophobic. Personally I think they can do whatever they want, but don't involve me.

 

I heard today on the ABC news that there is a high rate of juvenile mental illness and that the rate of attempted suicides in LGBTIs is 20%.

 

That is high and I would assume that the rate would have been lower when Gays were suppressed and afraid to "Come out"

 

What does that tell us?

 

 

[Marty_d]

Well, 30,40 or 50 years ago you didn't see the internet, cell phones, social media, and a whole bunch of other stuff too. Things change.

 

Gays decided they wanted to get " Married" I don't know what they can have being married that they can't have legally as a same sex couple.

So we should get rid of marriage for everyone? I don't see what heterosexual couples can have being married that they can't have legally as defacto.

 

I don't know what the past level of attempted suicide was with LGBTI people, especially given that they couldn't come out of the closet, they probably weren't even counted as gay. But again, I would argue that there's a whole bunch of other factors that affect not only LGBTI but ALL youth and leading to an increase in suicide attempts - cyber bullying, constant social media pressures, body image pressure, revenge porn, all stuff that just didn't exist back in the 60/70/80's.

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

...That is high and I would assume that the rate would have been lower when Gays were suppressed and afraid to "Come out"What does that tell us?

Not much, Yenn. As Marty said, kids today face a different set of pressures to what their parents did.

 

(I'm one of those lucky Boomers who had a choice of full time, lifetime jobs; I can't imagine the pressures on young people today.)

 

Anecdotal evidence tells us that suicide has been around for a long time, and has often been covered up.

 

Sexuality wasn't openly discussed. Every family had peculiar uncles and confirmed bachelors (and spinsters).

 

 

[facthunter]

60 years ago, if it got in the papers that you were gay your life was just about over. It was all kept under wraps. people married to look as if they were "normal" and led double lives. There's nothing new in people being same sex inclined. Its been fairly constant through history. At times more accepted than others, but often being given a hard time or even as in some societies today, they are killed, which hardly seems fair, one would think. Nev

 

 

[storchy neil]

nah 750 I'm not going to through in the towel just to piss em all off marriage is woman and man or man and women

 

two woman two men call it some thing other than marriage

 

should be rather amusing in the family law court neil

 

 

[facthunter]

All you have to do is put yourself in the other persons situation in your mind a little more. If one of your siblings, or a good friend or whatever decides He /She has been living a lie/ doesn't identify with the rather confusing gender identity concepts out there would you treat them differently? Unfriend them walk away, or be uncomfortable when they are around? They are still PEOPLE , Human beings like YOU. Religions are always confused about sex , often with the most extreme reactions, hate and denialism. and perversions/predation..Nev

 

 

[Yenn]

I wouldn't unfriend them or do anything really. I just cannot see why they need to be "Married"

 

I don't go along with all the hard times for people, young or old now.

 

When I was a kid I used to go to bed at night, never knowing if I would be alive the next morning. We had the top floor of our house alight from incendiary bombs. The front door blown off its hinges, but that was only while the war was going on. Afterwards all men between above the age of 18 had to go into the services, unless they were physicly unfit or had a job that was deemed to be important to the state. That was for two years and the pay was so poor that some blokes only got paid every two weeks. Bullying in schools was different then, it was physical rather than being belittled as happens nowadays.

 

On top of all that young people were meant to kep quiet and not question their elders. I was even taught in school, the correct way to write to my MP. The ending had to be "I remain Sir your obedient servant"

 

And people think life is tough now.

 

 

[spacesailor]

I agree with Yenn,

 

I Hated my school years.

 

Really wanted that RED button the Yanks had,

 

spacesailor

 

 

[Marty_d]

Well, if people want to vote either way) they've got about an hour left to get on the electoral roll.

 

I really hope all the younger people make an effort and have their say.

 

After all, it's their future.

 

 

[facthunter]

Quite a lot of them have. There's still options after the date for someone else to do it on your behalf. But it was an avoidable costly mess The LNP have stuffed up big time on this one. There's a residue of young people not attracted to them at all. Not surprising if you think about it. They will vote in the future for a long period. 60 + years on average, and they have memories. They have underestimated the younger generation.. They think for themselves a lot. They have to, as just look what leaving it to the other more knowledgeable (supposedly) has produced. Nev

 

 

[Bruce]

There are lots of couples in long-term relationships without getting married. Both of my kids, 2 brothers-in-law for example.

 

The unhappiest couple I ever knew ( they used to put each other in casualty from time to time) were married and stayed so till death did them part.

 

Pauline Hanson has suggested that the poll also ask about banning the burqua. I agree and would add asking about the level of immigration, obscene taxpayer-funded salaries, paying the dole with a card and limiting council rates to inflation rises.

 

These questions are much more important to me.

 

 

[spacesailor]

Bruce

 

Just found out my grandson was knocked off the dole because he said he didn't want to go back to school (Tafe). then his state house refused to renew his lease,

 

and on top of that his partner has six weeks before giving birth to their first child.

 

I think the system stinks. Another grandson has never been on Social-security, but they still have a file on him!.

 

spacesailor

 

 

[Bruce]

I'm real sorry space. Can you get your grandson to retract ? It looks like you are going to have to pick up the pieces and I hope they follow your advice... good luck and best wishes

 

 

[Bruce]

I agree red. We should make these things as non-discriminatory as we can. I was really upset that Howard did aboriginal intervention when there are plenty of ferals around here who are as bad or worse.

 

 

[Marty_d]

Just hope it's a resounding "yes" vote so that Australia can tick it off and everyone moves on with their life. If it's a "yes" but close, then the conservatives and religious will never stop bitching about it. If it's a "no" then the LBGTI community will keep the pressure on. The only way to slam the door on the issue for good is to make it obvious that a clear majority of the population support it.

 

 

[kgwilson]

The polls all point to an overwhelming "Yes" vote and that is the problem as it always is. Too many will not bother to return the survey form as they think the result is a foregone conclusion. If it close you can bet the ultra right Abbot mob will rant on about it being too close to call (due to a small percentage of survey forms returned etc) and try and force parliament to abandon the whole thing.

 

There is still hope though that the high court challenge to be heard on 5-6 September will pour cold water on the whole thing.

 

 

[Cosmick]

I'm a yes vote but i'm not certain of a win. The majority who are sorta yeah arn't passionate and as it is not compulsory a reasonable percentage may not vote. The religious will be banging it out in the sermons and the old fashioned will want to have their say. Wouldn't surprise me if its a 'NO' on the day.

 

 

[spacesailor]

Bruce

 

I doubt if he would, as he had a terrible time at school as he was (is) very ADHD & was drugged to the eyeballs on the request of the teacher's.

 

The doctor's had lots of sessions trying to get the injection into him, practically had to tie him to a chair at one stage.

 

We hoped he would be better away from that scene & at work, but the bosses can only take so much of his rants.

 

spacesailor

 

 

[octave]

Did you also know that under the so-called Safe Schools Program, a teacher can take an under aged girl to the doctor and put her on the pill without the parent's knowledge or consent?

No, a teacher can not "take an underage girl to the doctor and put her on the pill", this is exaggerated hysterical nonsense.

 

No Cookies | Herald Sun

 

 

[Bruce]

Don't give up space, you are just one of many families in this situation.

 

My advice is to look after yourself so that you are there and functioning when the wheel turns full circle and they need your help and advice.

 

 

[Marty_d]

Where is this crap going to end? Sodom and Gomorrah.

You do know that Sodom and Gomorrah was a story about gang rape, not homosexuality?

 

What does the Bible really say about same-sex marriage?