'Removal of politically incorrect statues' is ratcheted up. . .

[Marty_d]

I think you might get a few bites on that one, Bruce.

Not from me - I know Bruce's opinions on both nuclear and Greens, and unfortunately neither of them are likely to change.

 

 

[Phil Perry]

Oh No ! I'll have to change my brand of fags if they tear down the Peter Stuyvesant statue. . .( sob. . )

 

dailym.ai/2xlNSPE

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

...Ah yes, the 2% of the population are going to somehow overturn 117 years of federation, Westminster-style democracy, free and fair (mostly) courts and the rule of law, and we'll all be forced to become muslims and live in sharia law. Because of those leftie social worker lesbians with secret muslim tendencies.

Well said, Marty. The only thing preventing me from bunging a "winner" star on your post was this last bit.

 

Yes, it may seem fanciful to imagine that such a minority of the population could gain so much power. Unfortunately, in western democracies tiny minorities often wield power far beyond their numbers.

 

When voting is close, the support of fringe parties is often crucial for victory. For fifty years no candidate dared alienate the tiny Cuban expat community in America. In NSW the tiny Shooters party gained enormous influence over government decisions. Don't get me started on the largess thrown at Bob Katter's electorate to secure his vote.

 

Our parents would be amazed to see some recent legislative changes made in this country, so it shouldn't be hard to imagine Australia legalising sharia courts, poligamy and children being married to old men.

 

Too many politicians would do a deal with the devil to get into government.

 

A visiting Frenchman warned us years ago that once Moslems made up more than 5% of the population it's too late.

 

 

[spacesailor]

O K

 

Don't believe anything the French say.

 

They denied they had anything to do with the "Sinking of the rainbow-warrior".

 

Then they gave the government "terrorist", murderers, a luxury holiday.

 

spacesailor

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

O KDon't believe anything the French say.

 

They denied they had anything to do with the "Sinking of the rainbow-warrior".

 

Then they gave the government "terrorist", murderers, a luxury holiday.

 

spacesailor

Spacey I agree that episode was a shameful blot in French history, but it doesn't mean we shouldn't learn from their experience with Islamic immigration.

 

 

[Marty_d]

Talking of terrorists, heard an interview with Tony Jones about his new book ("the twentieth man"). He was saying he wasn't even aware that there was a terrorist attack involving 2 bombs, in Sydney, in which 16 people were injured (one bloke had his legs blown off.)

 

This took place in 1972. The perpetrators were believed to be Croatian nationalists.

 

We kind of forget that European terrorists have been blowing people up - Basque separatists, IRA etc - for decades. All of a sudden "terrorism" automatically means "muslims".

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

Not at all, Marty. Sydney also suffered the Hilton Hotel Bombing, which killed Senior Constable Paul Bermistrew. Who said Moslems have a monopoly on terrorism? Most of the conflicts you mention have been sorted; some by fairly peaceful means. I have little hope that the evil IS campaign will end with diplomacy.

 

 

[Phil Perry]

I wonder how many tonnes of high explosive would be needed to demolish Mount Rushmore. . . . Thanks to comments made in this thread, I have been reading more about the subject. This side issue was discussed when I was at grammar school in the early 1960s, ie, when teachers were allowed to present an argument without fear of being shouted down or sacked by those above having a specific interest in preserving the status quo of 'Accepted' historic events. . . .

 

If there is any truth at all in the following article, then it looks as if there need to be a whole lot more statues removed by those who wish not to leave history alone and just accept it for what it is, and that we, today, ARE NOT RESPONSIBLE for what happened then. . . .those who suffered,. . . those who died, cannot possibly achieve any succour whatsoever from what is now happening. . . however 'GOOD' it makes certain sections of the community feel.

 

Today's society seems to be all about social media driven 'Feelz' rather than pragmatics. . . .and certainly seem to have learned nothing at all from history. Mob rule it ( apparently ) is then. . . .

 

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

 

Here's some information about Lincoln, which our media may not be keen to share with you:

 

https://alethonews.wordpres...

 

The Lincoln Myth: Ideological Cornerstone of the America Empire

 

 

 

“Lincoln is theology, not historiology. He is a faith, he is a church, he is a religion, and he has his own priests and acolytes, most of whom . . . are passionately opposed to anybody telling the truth about him . . . with rare exceptions, you can’t believe what any major Lincoln scholar tells you about Abraham Lincoln and race.”

 

–Lerone Bennett, Jr., Forced into Glory, p. 114

 

The author of the above quotation, Lerone Bennett, Jr., was the executive editor of Ebony magazine for several decades, beginning in 1958. He is a distinguished African-American author of numerous books, including a biography of Martin Luther King, Jr. He spent twenty years researching and writing his book, Forced into Glory: Abraham Lincoln’s White Dream, from which he drew the above conclusion about the so-called Lincoln scholars and how they have lied about Lincoln for generations. For obvious reasons, Mr. Bennett is incensed over how so many lies have been told about Lincoln and race...

 

In contrast to his compromising stance on slavery, Lincoln was totally and completely uncompromising on the issue of tax collection in his first inaugural address, literally threatening war over it. For decades, Northerners had been attempting to plunder Southerners (and others) with high protectionist tariffs. There was almost a war of secession in the late 1820s over the “Tariff of Abominations” of 1828 that increased the average tariff rate (essentially a sales tax in imports) to 45%. The agricultural South would have been forced to pay higher prices for clothing, farm tools, shoes, and myriad other manufactured products that they purchased mostly from Northern businesses...

 

Treason is defined by Article 3, Section 3 of the U.S. Constitution as follows: “Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort.” The most important word here is “them.” As in all the founding documents, “United States” is always in the plural, signifying that the “free and independent states,” as they are called in the Declaration of Independence, are united in forming a compact or confederacy with other states. Levying war against “them” means levying war against individual states, not something called “the United States government.” Therefore, Lincoln’s invasion and levying of war upon the Southern states is the very definition of treason in the Constitution.

 

Lincoln took it upon himself to arbitrarily redefine treason, not by amending the Constitution, but by using brute military force. His new definition was any criticism of himself, his administration, and his policies. He illegally suspended the writ of Habeas Corpus (illegal according to this own attorney general, Robert Bates) and had the military arrest and imprison without due process tens of thousands of Northern-state citizens, including newspaper editors, the Maryland legislature, the mayor of Baltimore, the grandson of Francis Scott Key who was a Baltimore newspaper editor, Congressman Clement L. Vallandigham of Ohio, his chief critic in the U.S. Congress, and essentially anyone overheard criticizing the government...

 

The Lincoln regime reversed that progress and paved the way for all the gross wartime atrocities of the twentieth century by waging war on Southern civilians for four long years. Rape, pillage, plunder, the bombing and burning of entire cities populated only by civilians was the Lincolnian way of waging war – not on foreign invaders but on his own fellow American citizens. (Lincoln did not consider secession to be legal; therefore, he thought of all citizens of the Southern states to be American citizens, not citizens of the Confederate government).

 

General Sherman said in a letter to his wife that his purpose was “extermination, not of soldiers alone, that is the least part of the trouble, but the people” (Letter from Sherman to Mrs. Sherman, July 31, 1862). Two years later, he would order his artillery officers to use the homes of Atlanta occupied by women and children as target practice for four days, while much of the rest of the city was a conflagration. The remaining residents were then kicked out of their homes – in November with the onset of winter. Ninety percent of Atlanta was demolished after the Confederate army had left the city.

 

General Philip Sheridan similarly terrorized the civilians of the Shenandoah Valley in Virginia. All of this led historian Lee Kennett, in his biography of Sherman, to honestly state that “had the Confederates somehow won, had their victory put them in position to bring their chief opponents before some sort of tribunal, they would have found themselves justified . . . in stringing up President Lincoln and the entire Union high command for violation of the laws of war, specifically for waging war against noncombatants” ..

 

In a 1994 essay entitled “Just War” (online at https://mises.org/library/j..., Rothbard argued that the only two American wars that would qualify as just wars (defined as wars to ward off a threat of coercive domination) were the American Revolution and the South’s side in the American “Civil War.” Without getting into his detailed explanation of this, his conclusion is especially relevant and worth quoting at length:

 

“n this War Between the States, the South may have fought for its sacred honor, but the Northern war was the very opposite of honorable. We remember the care with which the civilized nations had developed classical international law. Above all, civilians must not be targeted; wars must be limited. But the North insisted on creating a conscript army, a nation in arms, and broke the 19th-century rules of war by specifically plundering and slaughtering civilians, by destroying civilian life and institutions so as to reduce the South to submission. Sherman’s famous march through Georgia was one of the great war crimes, and crimes against humanity, of the past century-and-a-half. Because by targeting and butchering civilians, Lincoln and Grant and Sherman paved the way for all the genocidal horrors of the monstrous 20th century..

 

 

 

Perhaps, some day, their statues will be toppled and melted down; their insignias and battle flag will be desecrated, and their war songs tossed into the fire.

 

 

 

Perhaps, some day. But in the meantime, and for the past 150 years, the mountain of lies that has concocted the Lincoln Myth has been invoked over and over again to “justify” war after war, all disguised as some great moral crusade, but in reality merely a tool to enrich the already wealthy-beyond-their-wildest-dreams military/industrial complex and its political promoter class. As Robert Penn Warren wrote in his 1960 book, The Legacy of the Civil War, the Lincoln Myth, painstakingly fabricated by the Republican Party, long ago created a “psychological heritage” that contends that “the Northerner, with his Treasury of Virtue” caused by his victory in the “Civil War,” feels as though he has “an indulgence, a plenary indulgence, for all sins past, present, and future.” This “indulgence,” wrote Warren, “is the justification for our crusades of 1917-1918 and 1941-1945 and our diplomacy of righteousness, with the slogan of unconditional surrender and universal rehabilitation for others” (emphasis added). Robert Penn Warren believed that most Americans were content with all of these lies about their own history, the work of what he called “the manipulations of propaganda specialists,” referring to those who describe themselves as “Lincoln scholars.”

 

 

 

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Lies and propaganda for selfish purposes - still the business of government in peace and war. . . .and on it goes. . . .

 

 

[Bruce]

In Australia, we have curiously done the opposite thing and we are atoning for atrocities which never happened. There is a move afoot to rename the arrival date of the first fleet as "invasion day" . Yet contemporary accounts describe how the aborigines didn't even look up from their oyster gathering as the fleet went past.

 

Not a very convincing invasion, methinks. More of an arrival.

 

And we have the stolen generation.. I would have known if any of the black kids in town had been stolen. In grade 4, I sat next to this black kid from Borroloola and he went home for school holidays . His name was Walter and we all correctly reckoned he was like at boarding school.

 

Apparently there is great compensation payments available for "stolen generation" examples but hardly any can demonstrate it happened to them... strange huh.

 

There were kids removed from bad circumstances, such as when you come across a dehydrated baby lying in 3 days of excrement in its cot, and some of these cases were reported as stolen.

 

 

[Bruce]

Phil, I am not surprised that the Nazis liked Napoleon. After all, they copied him even to the extent of losing their armies in Russia.

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

In Australia, we have curiously done the opposite thing and we are atoning for atrocities which never happened. There is a move afoot to rename the arrival date of the first fleet as "invasion day" . Yet contemporary accounts describe how the aborigines didn't even look up from their oyster gathering as the fleet went past.Not a very convincing invasion, methinks. More of an arrival.

 

And we have the stolen generation.. I would have known if any of the black kids in town had been stolen. In grade 4, I sat next to this black kid from Borroloola and he went home for school holidays . His name was Walter and we all correctly reckoned he was like at boarding school.

 

Apparently there is great compensation payments available for "stolen generation" examples but hardly any can demonstrate it happened to them... strange huh.

 

There were kids removed from bad circumstances, such as when you come across a dehydrated baby lying in 3 days of excrement in its cot, and some of these cases were reported as stolen.

Bruce with this post you have totally re-written Australian history.

 

Our nice, civilised ancestors arrived to save the poor miserable savages and improve their lives.

 

I feel much better now.

 

 

[Phil Perry]

In Australia, we have curiously done the opposite thing and we are atoning for atrocities which never happened. There is a move afoot to rename the arrival date of the first fleet as "invasion day" . Yet contemporary accounts describe how the aborigines didn't even look up from their oyster gathering as the fleet went past.Not a very convincing invasion, methinks. More of an arrival.

 

And we have the stolen generation.. I would have known if any of the black kids in town had been stolen. In grade 4, I sat next to this black kid from Borroloola and he went home for school holidays . His name was Walter and we all correctly reckoned he was like at boarding school.

 

Apparently there is great compensation payments available for "stolen generation" examples but hardly any can demonstrate it happened to them... strange huh.

 

There were kids removed from bad circumstances, such as when you come across a dehydrated baby lying in 3 days of excrement in its cot, and some of these cases were reported as stolen.

Interesting stuff Bruce. . .

 

We, I mean the collective 'WE' in the UK are now being called to account by the SJWs for previous 'Crimes' and this is ( supposed to be ) the reason why these people want certain historical statues removed.

 

I believe that Captain Cook is coming under the microscope in OZ. . . . .

 

I will be very sorry to hear that the 'Breakfast Creek' fish bar in Brissy ( If indeed it still exists in some form ) has to change it's name to something politically correct to atone for the crimes of James Cook. I've yet to discover a fish shop selling such a huge range of fresh fish as that place.. .you could watch the fishing boats mooring up in the creek behind the shop and unloading all sorts of fish. . . . .Coral Trout and chips ?. . . Grilled Barramundi ? Grilled / Battered flake ( shark I think ) Barracuda ?. . .Mullet. .? Turbot ? Their COD was to die for. . .Hmmmm slurp . . .. my local Pakistani fish shop owner has never even heard of these names . . . .we only get Pollock, ( Dunno ) a replacement for all the Cod that the EU Spanish fishermen hoover up from OUR fishing waters. . .or Haddock. . .My Mum ( RIP ) reckoned that the 'Haddock' was not right, it tasted like cardboard. . . .BUT. . if drowned in vinegar and salt,. . . and thickly battered, most folks nowadays wouldn't know. . . .

 

Turbot was highly regarded by Chinese restaurants in Brisbane, and my maet Gary and I ( He owned an 18 foot skiff ) caught several of these and we were astonished at how much money we were paid by the Chinese restaurant owners at the back door ( nudge nudge, wink wink ) but we got done for not having the correct licenses. . . .or, ( actually ) NO fishing licence at all. . .fair doos. . .but we made a few grand first with our six months of naughty fishin'. . . .damn, the things nearly jumped into the boat. . . .never seen fishing like it before nor since. . .( ! )

 

The BESTEST things of all were the Moreton Bay Bugs. . .Huge. . .Jeeze. . .if you ask for King Prawns at a restaurant nowadays ( in the UK ) the 'KING' prawns are a joke. . .!. ..

 

OH,. . .I MAY have gorn a bit off topic here. . .( Sorry . . .)

 

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( I'm the thin bloke BTW )

 

[Bruce]

Its true guys, I have told the story of how an old but lucid aboriginal man who remembered the time before whitefellows had any impact on their lives told me exactly that.( well he told his grand-daughter who asked him for me)

 

" Much better after whitefeller" he said " before there was all this killing"

 

Read Jared Diamond for a fuller account of why this was so.

 

 

[Marty_d]

Here's some information about Lincoln, which our media may not be keen to share with you:

 

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

 

 

Lies and propaganda for selfish purposes - still the business of government in peace and war. . . .and on it goes. . . .

But here's the rub. If you trust nothing from the "mainstream media", but trust anything by people who say only they know the truth, then how do you verify anything?

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

You'll find proof of whatever you believe, if you know where to look.

 

 

[Bruce]

So very true Old K, it defines our species I reckon. We have the ability to sincerely believe whatever suits us and accordingly select some bits of evidence and ignore others.

 

I particularly like reading of studies which "prove" how good red wine is for you.

 

 

[willedoo]

I particularly like reading of studies which "prove" how good red wine is for you.

It was too good for me; I had to reduce the dosage.

 

 

[facthunter]

Truth is hard to find as most don't value it. You have to really want to seek it. " Selective perception" is a well known psychological phenomenon. Animals must have an ability to fly, run or fight, and react quickly, so as to survive.

 

Indecision is not a comfortable or helpful state for them, for survival but this doesn't apply to making decisions that affect complex things well into the future where a thorough analysis of all available facts will pay off and anything less, make a disaster possible. Nev

 

 

[Phil Perry]

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[Bruce]

There is a bit of a movement in Australia to refer to the arrival of whites as "invasion day".

 

Well in the central Australian area I grew up in, the aborigines were ( in time ) saved by whites from a terrible existence similar to the first cartoon.

 

I have actually had that confirmed by an old but lucid aboriginal elder. Not that the first whites were benign ( except for the missionaries ) but because their lives before were so terrible.

 

 

[Marty_d]

Yeah... must have been shocking... they only lasted for 50,000 years without us.

 

 

[Bruce]

Good point Marty. I shudder to think whats going to happen to them when the wheels fall off the whitefellers gravy train. Then we would say they were better off feeding themselves and being left alone.

 

 

[willedoo]

Not only statues are in the firing line. This war memorial and mausoleum housing the remains of 56 Soviet soldiers has just been demolished in

 

Poland. The sad thing is that it has stood since WW2, and it's only current Russophobia that is driving this sort of destruction in Poland, Ukraine and the Baltics.

 

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