Electric Cars - the discussion continues.

[pmccarthy]

An interesting aside:

 

The Broken Hill mines operated at 240 volts 40 Hertz and had their own diesel power stations. When the NSW grid reached the town in the 1980s it was possible to install solid state frequency converters 50 Hz to 40 Hz so the mines didn’t have to replace thousands of motors, some such as mills and hoists were very large. I was surprised that solid state converters could do that.

 

 

[Kyle Communications]

In metro QLD basically if the electricity is running past your house it doesnt matter if you pull your service down or disconnect from the mains you get charged the access fee its a day rate borks out about $120 a quarter. You can see mine is 112 cents per day plus the solar meter charge etc...pricks. Its the same as the water rates here ..you can disconnect or not use the mains water but they charge you about the same because town water runs past your house

 

[ATTACH]50040._xfImport[/ATTACH]

 

[pmccarthy]

It will be a major problem for electric power as more people go off grid. They will be obliged to continue paying fixed charges to support the network. A political hand grenade for five years time.

 

 

[spacesailor]

They run that same extortion in NSW

 

My Daughters ex's family payed for water to their empty block of land (next door with no taps) for years,as well as excess water for their home (with pool).

 

He & family were builders, So my thinking, put in a tap for that swimming pool,

 

now they can water the spare block and top-up their pool, for no further expense.

 

(still pay the extortion money)

 

spacesailor

 

 

[red750]

Back to electric cars. Where it is quoted to charge a Nissan Leaf 8-12 hours, that is in the USA, where their power is 110 volts. With 240 volts in Australia, a full charge should take around 4 hours. Put it on at 7 pm, take it off at 11 pm, before bed.

 

An electric car is way out of my reach, but if I get a call from the Cash Cow, I might afford a secondhand Prius, 840 km on a full tank.

 

 

[facthunter]

A big liability buying a second hand hybrid like that. The only way to get rid of them is to trade it in on a new one. Don't go there

 

Regarding access tot the grid. It does have a value you should be prepared to pay if you need to ever use it. It's about the same price as renting two gas cylinders.. It's CHEAP. You won't do a lot of welding IF you are off grid.. Nev

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

They run that same extortion in NSWMy Daughters ex's family payed for water to their empty block of land...

If council had extended their lines to give us access to their water and sewerage systems when we bought our block they would have been entitled to charge us for it.

 

They didn't, so we had to build our own water and sewerage services. This cost us lots at the time.

 

The result? We pay much lower rates and have set up the system to suit our own needs.

 

It also means that if anything goes wrong, we have to fix it.

 

 

[spacesailor]

BUT

 

In NSW even without power & water/sewerage to your property you still pay the rates to your council for NO water power OR rubbish collection.

 

Son-in-law's block doesn't get the road fixed, the owners hire contractors themselves.

 

Just paid my power-bill, they give us $50 discount for paying on time, BUT nothing for paying Before time. LoL

 

spacesailor

 

 

[octave]

BUTIn NSW even without power & water/sewerage to your property you still pay the rates to your council for NO water power OR rubbish collection.

 

Son-in-law's block doesn't get the road fixed, the owners hire contractors themselves.

 

Just paid my power-bill, they give us $50 discount for paying on time, BUT nothing for paying Before time. LoL

 

spacesailor

For 20 years I owned and lived on a bush block near Braidwood on the southern tablelands. We had no water or power but we were not charged for those services either. Every rate payer paid a basic rate and then those who lived in town paid an extra fee for water and sewage as well as rubbish collection. RE elec bill, with my bill from AGL I get a $100 discount for paying early. Just paid my latest bill although it is not due for a couple of weeks.

 

 

[red750]

These comments would be better on a separate thread, they have nothing to do with e-l-e-c-t-r-i-c- v-e-h-i-c-l-e-s,

 

 

[spacesailor]

Except for the cost of REFUELING said vehicle.

 

spacesailor

 

 

[octave]

So I am staying with my son in NZ at the moment, and he has lent me his BMWI3 EV. I have been driving it long enough now to get comfortable with it, in fact the first trick is accepting how easy it is to drive. At first, it seems very strange, press a button and the screens come to life, toggle the switch in to drive and off you go.

 

The acceleration is rather impressive not only in terms of how quick it is off the mark but how the accelerator works smoothly throughout it's range. Lifting of the accelerator is like applying the brake so you dont coast up to an intersection but gradually lift off, in fact you can drive most of the time without even touching the brake, the regenerative braking does the work.

 

We have driven up some extremely steep hills and we found that it felt as if we were on the flat. In an ICE you are aware of the engine working hard. The other day there was an accident on our route home and the traffic was alternating between a crawl and a stand still. This is a good vehicle for this situation. I was aware of all the other vehicles around us idling away burning fuel.

 

This I3 is a 2014 model with a range extender. The range extenders is a petrol motor (2 cylinder, base on a BMW motor bike engine) This engine will automatically start when the batteries get to 7% I believe although we have not had this happen. You can also set the range extender to hold a set charge.

 

The new models no longer have the range extender but have a larger battery bank. When the vehicle returns home at night you just plug it in. It does not immediately charge (unless you instruct it to) but starts changing when the electric price drops and it is good to go in the morning.

 

My son has several cars and usually lends us a BMW 5 series which is very thirsty. We of course pay for our fuel and always return it full which in NZ is very costly (about $2.15 a litre at the moment) It was amusing offering to pay for the electricity we used as when charged off-peak it costs 90 cents per 100km ($2.70 during day rate). My son suggested I could buy him a cup of coffee every couple of days. The maintenance costs are very low, occasional servicing of the extender (which hardly ever gets used) Brakes last a long time since they are not used very much. Tyres are expensive though.

 

I would love a car like this but at this point it is not in my price but like other items such as mobile phones PCs etc it is only a matter of time.

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

If only our dinasour politicians would stop telling alarmist lies about EVs and renewables...

 

...I would love a car like this but at this point it is not in my price but like other items such as mobile phones PCs etc it is only a matter of time...

Don't worry Octave, pretty soon you might inherit one. My wife and I have aquired quite a few "hand-me-ups" from our kid and her hubby.

 

 

[spacesailor]

Octave,

 

Sounds good, maybe he will let you have it when it's his time to upgrade.

 

LoL

 

spacesailor

 

 

[kgwilson]

The price of petrol is expensive in NZ but it costs just $80.00 a year to register a car and that includes CTP which is the ACC levy. (ACC is a government system to cover workers compensation & accidents etc. The right to sue has been removed by law.) Here the registration & CTP cost is $ 700.00 and up to several thousand depending on your age and the vehicle. You can buy a lot of fuel for the extra 65 cents a litre so for majority the overall cost is actually less to run a car in NZ than in Australia.

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

The price of petrol is expensive in NZ but it costs just $80.00 a year to register a car and that includes CTP which is the ACC levy. (ACC is a government system to cover workers compensation & accidents etc...

Another reason to move across the ditch!

 

A levy on fuel to pay for CTP was proposed in NSW but, like so many good ideas, it fizzled. No doubt the big insurance companies made political donations...

 

 

[octave]

[Q

 

The price of petrol is expensive in NZ but it costs just $80.00 a year to register a car and that includes CTP which is the ACC levy. (ACC is a government system to cover workers compensation & accidents etc. The right to sue has been removed by law.) Here the registration & CTP cost is $ 700.00 and up to several thousand depending on your age and the vehicle. You can buy a lot of fuel for the extra 65 cents a litre so for majority the overall cost is actually less to run a car in NZ than in Australia.

Yes quite true, this is one of th reasons my Australian son is now a Kiwi. His household has I think 5 cars, all suited to different purposes.

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

...His household has I think 5 cars, all suited to different purposes.

That would have been a major benefit of the CTP from fuel levy proposal- it might have saved a mob of fuel. Without it, huge numbers of Australians commute in thirsty 4WDs that were never intended for the purpose.

 

 

[Marty_d]

Kiwis. Pretty much smarter than us in every way.

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

Kiwis. Pretty much smarter than us in every way.

Whoa there Marty!

 

I like 'me, but that's going a bit far. Perhaps there are institutional reasons their country seems better-run.

 

Is their media dominated by one foreign owner whose only value is profit?

 

Are ordinary citizens able to actually have any influence on the national agenda?

 

Do their governments run scared of being white-anted by undercover foreign corporate interests?

 

Is their whole national identity based on contrived myth and coverups?

 

Does their country occupy such a strategic position on the globe that one great power or another must dominate it?

 

 

[pmccarthy]

I was paying $2.40 a litre two weeks ago around Christchurch. $100 every time I filled Mr Avis's Corolla.

 

 

[kgwilson]

Even at 90 cents difference in the price if the rego comparison of say $80 to $700, $620.00 buys 258 litres of fuel & in a Corolla that will still get you about 4,500 km of driving. The tax on fuel in NZ is almost double what it is here at just over 70 cents per litre. Then there is 15% GST on top of that (tax on a tax just like here) & in Auckland an extra 10 cents congestion tax. Prices in NZ are generally more expensive than in Australia as GST is on absolutely everything except financial transactions like mortgages but the top income tax rate is 30%, there is no medicare levy and the Pension is not means tested.

 

When everything is taken in to account there is not much difference except how things are run. The NZ government seems much more progressive and they have bi-partisan support on Climate Change and attitude towards electric vehicles. NZ has its own nutters like we have Hansen, Anning, Palmer and Katter.

 

Something I found rather amusing this week was a survey of 1400 Australians found Jacinda Adern as the most trusted politician - In Australia. Millward Brown polled 1400 Australians and asked them to score 12 politicians on their relevance, integrity, shared values, affinity, commitment and follow through. Despite being a Kiwi Adern scored 77 out of 100, next was Penny Wong at 53 then Julie Bishop on 52 & Tania Plibosek at 50. So the top 4 are all women. Morrison was 8th at 43, Shorten 42, Abbott 36, Dutton 34 & unsurprisingly in last place Palmer on 30.

 

Bishop had the highest ranking for PM, at 14 per cent. Shorten came in second at 12 per cent, Morrison (11 per cent), Pauline Hanson (8 per cent), and Wong and Plibersek both sat at 6 per cent.

 

 

[Yenn]

So what will happen, if and when electric cars become common. Governments are going to miss out on the money to maintain roads. Some polly is going to come up with a way of fleecing us of even more money. If we can work out the most likely method of taxing us we may be able to get around id.

 

 

[facthunter]

Roads have to be paid for by someone.. Getting users to do it seems reasonable. Some roads we still use were built in the depression. Mid 30"s. They were mostly cement (concrete) tarred at the expansion joins. A lot of drainage was done at the same time. Some benefit and work for some.

 

. Topical today is conversation/ concerns on housing . Getting a house was never THAT easy. One should remember that Houses then were smaller simpler and no aircond, or insulation, probably about 1/3rd of the size of the Multi storey Mc mansions in Hell street at Chaos town Central with a 4 car garage ready made Lawn, and trees, Concrete drives and Brick fences with automatic Gates.. A car was about the same price as a basic house, if you bought a new one, which few did.. Cars are really cheap today. with all the gadgets included.. Houses?? You pay a lot for position. Market forces at play there and If the Locality is expensive the house must be up to the value of the area. or you blow your dough. What's happening NOW is older still quite comfortable housing is just pushed over. after purchase. and some giant structure that overlooks everyone else is erected. and you can't find a place to park your car electric or otherwise.. Nev

 

 

[spacesailor]

And the cyclist will still want smooth road for free !.

 

With a passenger trailer, uninsured of course.

 

spacesailor