An account, by an ex-soldier, about 'Hearts and Minds' and how the USA fails in this regard

[Phil Perry]

Here's an interesting account by an ex-soldier, of how the American military goes around the world losing hearts and minds, very arrogantly and expensively.

 

https://southfront.org/work...

 

WORKING WITH THE U.S. MILITARY IN AFGHANISTAN

 

It is also important to understand that during the NATO Afghan deployments, as well as during joint military exercises in Europe, America’s NATO allies are also unified by their frustrations regarding the conduct of the American military forces.

 

The most frequently cited area of concern regarding the American forces has been their disproportionate uses of force during engagements. In situations where ground forces can safely deal with a situation, American forces will generally use far greater amounts of ordnance than needed, creating a level of destruction far greater than needed – a level of destruction that would qualify in some cases as war crimes.

 

As an example of this, when a surgical strike with a helicopter launched Hellfire missile could easily resolve a conflict, the American military will instead opt to annihilate a town or village with a series of strikes by 1000 pound GBU-31 and 2000 pound GBU-32 JDAM (Joint Direct Attack Munitions) ordnance.

 

The appalling destruction created by the use of such powerful weapons leaves little more than rubble and dismembered bodies in its wake, with shocked survivors stumbling amidst the ruins searching for relatives and friends, and being treated by the arriving ISAF medical teams. Generally the Americans are nowhere to be found until several weeks later when they arrive to pay whomever remains for this ‘collateral damage’.

 

 

 

On average, families are paid $1,000.00 US for each life taken in the strike, with lower payments offered for child casualties. Considering that the cheapest laser-guided bomb costs the US $15,000.00 per unit, these small payments made for the loss of human life caused by these strikes is a bargain for the American forces.

 

Beyond this disproportionate use of force and loss of innocent life, what infuriates most ISAF troops is the callous, even indifferent attitude of the US forces when challenged regarding this behavior. Some common replies to such criticism are ‘They’re just Afghanis’, or are merely ‘casualties in the War on Terror’, or perhaps ‘they shouldn’t have let terrorists into their homes’...

 

Normally, ISAF operations are under the full control of their respective home countries. Unfortunately, the US military does not consider its allies as equal partners and often goes behind their backs and commences operations without their allies’ knowledge or consent. Obviously this behavior has created a loss of trust in the US army among non-US ISAF commanders...

 

The manner in which the US changes its stance and position to whatever is most expedient for them at the time also holds true for any agreement made between a foreign army and the US military. The Americans may smile at you as if you were a friend, shake your hand as if they mean it, and make you feel like you are their ally in this War on Terror, but beware – it’s all for show. In the eyes of the US, allies are to be used as auxiliary forces, and are definitely not worthy of being considered as equals...

 

The belief that the US military is the largest and most modern military on the planet is a deeply ingrained belief among the Americans, as is the belief that they are warriors fighting the forces of evil wherever in the world they may be deployed.

 

This belief in the doctrine of ‘American Exceptionalism’ runs deeply in the culture and history of the United States, leading American forces to believe that they possess the best weaponry, training and tactics than any other nation they may face as an adversary. This belief has often directly led to disastrous results in many US actions in Afghanistan. Believing themselves to be superior to any threat they might possibly face, they often throw caution to the wind during their operations...

 

No matter who you may ask, be they Czech, German, French, British, Dutch, Canadian, or Australian, all share the opinion that Americans are especially prideful and arrogant...

 

Worse still, the US Army has a long tradition of not learning from past mistakes, and of never admitting that they had been in the wrong. Such an institutional culture of covering up mistakes can only lead to the same mistakes being repeated and resulting in yet more needless loss of life. They perceive the admission of mistakes as being potentially damaging to the image of the US as invincible superpower, and not as a valuable learning experience that could prevent similar errors and losses in the future.

 

Hubris searching for Nemesis.

 

 

[Bruce]

For most of my life, the US outspent the rest of the world on its military. Now it only outspends the next 12 or so countries.

 

In WW2, they took more care of their own soldier's lives than anyone else, including the British and Australians. For example, they didn't do mop-ups against marooned Japanese , unlike the Australians who lost lots of troops on the Kokoda trail.

 

And the worst most wasteful stupid thing was Montgomery's glider-borne attack at night on Sicily. Too few survived the landing to be much of a force.

 

Well there is a lot of competition for that stupid wasteful accolade , Gallipoli comes to mind. While there were US debacles, they were less I reckon.

 

But here's a thought ( not mine)... WW2 was a disaster in that it gave us all the idea of a "just war, where the forces of evil are bested by the forces of the righteous" and so there has been far more support for lots of wars than there should have been.

 

 

[spacesailor]

Poor Germany

 

Didn't go to war against the British,

 

The Pom's declared war on them!.

 

spacesailor

 

 

[octave]

Poor GermanyDidn't go to war against the British,

 

The Pom's declared war on them!.

 

spacesailor

I know right, there they were just minding there own business (except for invading Poland)

 

 

[Bruce]

Yes that's right space. It was only the accident of Churchill being there ( a half American but still a pommy aristocrat, and a person who loved war) which caused that declaration of war. Without Churchill, the prime minister would likely have been Lord Halifax, who admired Hitler. The German deputy ( Hess) couldn't believe what had happened and he actually went to England to fix the mistake, whereupon he was put in jail.

 

 

[robinsm]

I always thought that the British joined the WW2 as a result of treaties with their european partners, ie...poland. The yanks only joined because the Japs gave them a blood nose and the japs had agreements with Germany. The ynks were busy sitting on the sidelines untill that happenned.

 

 

[Phil Perry]

I once had a girlfriend named Pandora. . . .

 

 

[Bruce]

The British also had a treaty with the Czechs which they didn't honor. I don't know why the Poles didn't help the Czechs.

 

And the US gave the Japs the first bloody nose by cutting off their oil. Mind you, the Japs were doing dreadful things in China.

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

... The yanks only joined because the Japs gave them a blood nose and the japs had agreements with Germany. The ynks were busy sitting on the sidelines untill that happenned.

Not quite. Just like during WWI, American industrialists were flat out making money from the war- by supplying both sides.

 

In Warren Beatty's movie Reds, his character had just returned to the USA after visiting war-torn Europe. At a dinner for the super rich he was asked what the war was about. His one-word answer still holds true today:

 

"Profits".

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

...Without Churchill, the prime minister would likely have been Lord Halifax, who admired Hitler. The German deputy ( Hess) couldn't believe what had happened and he actually went to England to fix the mistake, whereupon he was put in jail.

Spandau Prison in Berlin was kept open to house just one man: Rudolf Hess. He hadn't been involved in war crimes like The Final Solution. His crime was to fly to Scotland in an attempt to negotiate peace with Britain.

 

While he was locked up all the actual Nazi war criminals were released after serving their sentences. After he died in gaol the place was demolished. Files about him are still secret. Why?

 

 

[Phil Perry]

Doncha just Lurve how these threads sort of,. . .develop . . . .( Rhetorical )

 

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

Pan

 

Doncha just Lurve how these threads sort of,. . .develop . . . .( Rhetorical )

 

Pandora's box? After all, this is the off topic patch!

 

 

[Phil Perry]

Spandau Prison in Berlin was kept open to house just one man: Rudolf Hess. He hadn't been involved in war crimes like The Final Solution. His crime was to fly to Scotland in an attempt to negotiate peace with Britain.While he was locked up all the actual Nazi war criminals were released after serving their sentences. After he died in gaol the place was demolished. Files about him are still secret. Why?

OK,. . .I've tried for decades to get an answer to that question. . . .Best and ONLY answer I got from a Governmnt FOI ( Freedom of Information ) request, from some nondescript Civil Servant, who did not even show me the courtesy of signing his / her name BTW. . .was. . .'This is a very complex subject. . .we will, however, try to answer your valid question on the matter. . .I had told them that I was a freelance Journalist ( Not a lie ) compiling information for a book on the background to the Second World War.

 

I've been waiting five years for a response. . . It was obviously a VERY complex subject. . . .and has evidently been 'Memory Holed' . . .

 

Buuulcrap. . .Buuulcrap. . .it all sounds like Bullcrap to me, to me. . . . ( sung to the tune of My Bonnie lies over the ocean )

 

 

[Phil Perry]

Pan

Pandora's box? After all, this is the off topic patch!

I NEVER even alluded to her private parts you larrikin !

 

 

[Phil Perry]

Off Topic for a moment,. .. it's like Fireworks Armageddon around here at the moment,. . . I was invited to a Sikh Wedding today, but was working, and it is not acceptable ( To ME anyway,. . ) to attend a reception if you have not attended the ceremony. .. so I politely declined, with some reasonable sounding excuse. . . . It's another one of the three Sons of the local corner shop owner, young Navdeep Singh, who has married an auburn haired English Rose named Caitlin. . .. .Oh well,. . .it saved me having to pin a Twenty Pound Note to her wedding dress ( Traditional ) as the happy couple paraded around the room. .. so it's not ALL bad news. . ( ! )

 

Whether she will be expected to convert to the Sikh faith, . . .I do not know, but this pair have been friends since their schooldays, when they went to school in the same year as my small Daughter, and were classmates. . .. The firework display is a commercial one, and the opening salvo could be heard for many miles, ( usually a 'Maroon' rocket with a very loud bang, like those used to alert Volunteer Lifeboat crew when there's a SHOUT. . . I'm surprised my back windows survived the shockwave. . .)

 

I wish them both best wishes ( and have sent a card ) I regret not being able to imbibe all the free bottles of whisky, Vodka, Brandy et al, that every male guest is given at a wedding reception like this. . . . ( sobs. . .)

 

 

[robinsm]

Not quite. Just like during WWI, American industrialists were flat out making money from the war- by supplying both sides.

In Warren Beatty's movie Reds, his character had just returned to the USA after visiting war-torn Europe. At a dinner for the super rich he was asked what the war was about. His one-word answer still holds true today:

 

"Profits".

Sorry, sitting on the sideline and making money by doing it....thanks

 

 

[nomadpete]

Pan

Pandora's box? After all, this is the off topic patch!

They don't develop. They drift creatively in order to maintain interest and involvement.

 

 

[Phil Perry]

They don't develop. They drift creatively in order to maintain interest and involvement.

Agreed Pete. . .and they quite often develop in unexpected directions too. . .which makes them all the more interesting IMO. . .

 

 

[Bruce]

My wife figured out the Hess reason right away.

 

The Germans must have had good reason why they believed the British would never make war on them. And so it was to protect the people ( including royals) who had given the Germans these assurances that Hess had to be kept silent.

 

The powers that be will never admit to this until 100 years have passed.

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

...The powers that be will never admit to this until 100 years have passed.

...which is the main reason I plan to still be alive in 2041, when the British are due to release the Hess files.

 

 

[Bruce]

Lots of things point to that conclusion, for example the fact that he wasn't murdered but lived moderately well for a jailbird. The very powerful people who didn't want him to testify were not murderers and they obviously felt some guilt.

 

 

[Geoff13]

Spandau Prison in Berlin was kept open to house just one man: Rudolf Hess. He hadn't been involved in war crimes like The Final Solution. His crime was to fly to Scotland in an attempt to negotiate peace with Britain.While he was locked up all the actual Nazi war criminals were released after serving their sentences. After he died in gaol the place was demolished. Files about him are still secret. Why?

I was in Berlin when Rudolf Hess died. Spandau prison was demolished overnight, in fact within 12 hours of his death it was just a pile of rubble in the corner of a big open square. (Of that much I am certain.)

 

The following reason was what circulated around the units within Berlin at the time. I am not certain of the facts as I was not party to the decision making I do however tend to believe it.

 

The reason being that the British, the Americans and the Russians took turns of guarding him for 2 weeks at a time.

 

It was the only time that Russians were allowed to carry weapons in the West.

 

Hess died on the last night of the British Guard and they were due to change over at 0800 next morning.

 

The Brits demolished the prison so that the Russians would have no reason to come in.

 

The replacement guard was turned around at checkpoint Charlie.

 

 

[Bruce]

Geoff, that story adds to the theory that Hess could have embarrassed some important people if his story got out.