USA moving it's Embassy to Jerusalem

[Phil Perry]

I've seen the faux horror in the UK and worldwide Press about this,. . . I am not a religious person. However, my Aunt Ethel is. ( she's 88 years old and bright as a button bless her ) her response to all the TV political palaver was this, and I copy her email verbatim, this in response to Muslim claims that they were there first.

 

Here beginneth the Quote. . . .

 

* Jerusalem. The City of David. Who was David? David was King of Israel. Where do Kings live? In palaces. Where was David's 'palace? Jerusalem. What do Kings who live in palaces make? Capital cities.

 

2 Samuel chapter 5: 4 David was thirty years old when he became king, and he reigned forty years. 5 In Hebron he reigned over Judah seven years and six months, and in Jerusalem he reigned over all Israel and Judah thirty-three years. ( Here endeth the lesson )

 

Dunno what the dates are here, but she seems to suggest that the Jews were there using it as a capital rather a long time before anyone else. She also said that any claims from Islamics to the contrary were total Bolllox, with Zero historical / Empirical evidence of any kind whatsoever to support their claims. .

 

I am not a biblical scholar, Ethel was. She was the collator and administrator of a large library in the UK, ( Birmingham City ) specializing in the 'religion' section of the library for a couple of decades..

 

Just to be fair, she does not like Islam at all. This needs to be said.

 

A quote of hers was "The promotion of a Religion begun by a Deified, immoral and uneducated Bedouin is utterly absurd"

 

Whether she plagiarised this from Kemal Attaturk, the founder of 'Modern' Secular Turkey, is a moot point.

 

Kemal Attaturk changed and modernized the Turkish spoken and written language away from the mish mash of Armenian, Kurdish and Arabic influences to that used today, making Turkey an almost 'Westernized' state, unencumbered by Islam. Something which the current leader Recip Tayip Erdogan ( The 'Would Be' Caliph ) is doing his level best to overturn completely in that country.

 

I wonder if the Christian faithful will ever rise again and retake Istanbul, and change it's name back to Constantinople. . .?

 

 

[old man emu]

Since there is documentary evidence in several cultures, and dateable archaeological remains showing the occupation of the valley of the Jordan River by the Semitic speaking peoples, of whom the group calling itself Jews is but one, from several centuries before the demise of the Egyptian pharaonic civilization and the rise of the Roman Imperial phase, then the case is clear cut that the Jews, and their religious philosophy existed long before the birth of the Prophet of Islam.

 

It must be recognised that those peoples calling themselves Arabs, coexisted with the Jews in that part of the world from antiquity and both groups waged economic war for centuries until the rise of the Ottoman Empire in the 13th Century CE when the Ottoman conquerors of the Jordanian region emphasised Islam as the State religion, to the detriment of Judaism and Christianity, and any other minor religious philosophies.

 

 

[Yenn]

This problem with Jews and arabs is caused by the Western governments, such as Britain, Germany and USA.

 

The Jews lived all over the world and they had lost Jerusalem many years ago.

 

They agitated to be given Arab lands and the Brits as usual, promised a lot and gave little. Meanwhile the USA was just about anti Semitic. Then Hitler committed the final solution. The USA got a sudden love of the underdog. The Jews took over Arab lands by terrorism, and have been backed by the Yanks ever since.

 

If we subscribe to what has happened, will we also allow the Australian Aborigines to declare Sydney the capital of their Aboriginal nation?

 

 

[gareth lacey]

Jewish peoples were there before islam was thought about by the despotic tribal warlord Mohamed so ergo long before :muslims say it was their land , Jerusalem is their capital all this nonsense about being given their lands to the Jews by brits,yanks is a furphy , I for one are with the Israeli people and the mussies don't really want to mess with them, they all got their arses wiped(muslims) by the Israeli,s in the 6 day war, do you think that they cannot do it again, its only the Yanks,Brits that keep them from smashing the arabs ,hit the Israeli,s and they hit back twice as hard

 

 

[old man emu]

Be careful!

 

You have to distinguish between the Semetic group called "Arabs" and the followers of the Islamic faith. They are not necessarily the same.

 

What the fight is about in the "Holy Land" is a continuation of the territorial dispute that began when Joshua, of the Jewish Semetic group, conquered Jericho. It just so happens that the group that calls itself "Arabs" converted itself from a polytheistic belief system to a monotheistic system based on the teachings of Muhammad, and hat added another dimension to the dispute.

 

Don't forget, that the British promised self rule to the Arab tribes is they helped overcome the Ottomans during WWI. That promise would probably have been kept to a great degree if the French, whose homeland at the time was partially occupied by Germany, didn't go whinging to Britain that they wanted their lebensraum in the Holy Land. Wonder where young Adolf got the idea that he espoused in the mid 1930's?

 

So the British reneged on their promise to the Arabs, which put the Arabs offside with Britain. Then the Yanks (the most racist society in the world) got pushed by the millions of Jews who had fled there at the turn of the 20th Century to create a Jewish homeland for the survivors of the Holocaust. That got the Arabs offside with the Yanks, who believe their capitalist system is a Supreme Being's gift to Mankind.

 

 

[Marty_d]

A quote of hers was "The promotion of a Religion begun by a Deified, immoral and uneducated Bedouin is utterly absurd"

I've never heard of a religion begun by an educated person, with the possible exceptions of Scientology, where the inventor is on the record as saying that the best way to make millions is to start a religion, and the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster, where the inventors are making a fairly pointed jab at organised religion.

 

Not to mention that religion, in and of itself, is utterly absurd... (just my opinion!)

 

 

[old man emu]

I don't know about religions other than Christianity, but Christianity's basis of doing right by others (Love, Charity) has provided consolation to many people when their lives are in crisis.

 

Is there a Supreme Being? Only death will tell. As I have said before, is it possible to follow the philosophy of Christ without believing is a Supreme Being? As far as I am concerned, the philosophy of Christ is the only one that promotes peace and harmony in society. And before you start throwing up all the atrocities attributed to Christians, remember that none of the excuses for those atrocities can be found in the basic philosophy of Christ. The excuses arise with perverted Christianity.

 

 

[facthunter]

Religion has become a vehicle for justifying doing ungodly, cruel and barbaric things to the other side. Man created In the IMAGE of GOD???. Man MUST be pretty perfect then. But where is Mrs GOD? On earth, men who don't have a "normal" Mrs are supposed to be suss., especially around Kids.

 

Tribes CREATE Gods to explain natural phenomena , (Sun coming up, going down, Rain, Lightning, Floods and to punish miscreants. Eg ETERNAL DAMNATION, HELLFIRE and BRIMSTONE. MEN Interpret "everything" so HOW is God directly doing anything?. I know "HE " works in Mysterious ways. That gives a hell of a lot of leeway. There's plenty of room there for CORRUPTION and it IS there when you look, let's not pretend.

 

TRUST in GOD. Just pick the right one and what form HE Gender again? has. Every religion believes ALL the others are wrong and deserve to be killed. SO you must pick the right one if you want to survive HERE, let alone get to the NEXT world.( If there is one). I believe the universe is incomprehensibly VAST and contains unfathomable energy. This earth is more unique than we think as it contains some of the oldest materials in the universe. The idea the GOD designs each of us to MULTIPLY and rule over the animals (eat them) who have no soul but feel pain, have fear and share the majority of our genes and the universe and is only 6,300 years old is wide of the mark and extremely unlikely to have anything whatsoever to do with reality, yet the majority of the USA believe that to be true. Why is it not worrying in the extreme. We are in an information age but, .many choose to not know. Nev

 

 

[old man emu]

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[Yenn]

Are we in an information age or is it really a disinformation age?

 

I find it amazing that faith can make people believe in what to me appears to be just mumbo jumbo.

 

Funny thing is when the religious zealots come calling they will agree with me about just about anything I say, just hoping to convert me to stupidity. Those who are already converted will answer my comments about all the bad things done by religious people, by saying "but of course they are not real christians" or whatever religion.

 

Sorry OME your last post popped up while I was writing this one. You really do look sad.

 

Cheer up for Christmas.

 

 

[facthunter]

OME . There's some lovely Christian people and probably many really nice people in other belief god centred systems too. There's also some very understanding lovely anti theists philosophers and humanists too. The IDEA you have to be religious to be GOOD offends me. Self righteousness is not goodness ( and I'm not suggesting YOU mean that it is).

 

Essentially there's a lot of " Be like US, or piss off, because we have the meaning of life( Make lots of MONEY for a FEW of us who call the shots), and you have MUD houses and no military. and don't call the shots either because you have OUR oil and your Princes only get to reap the benefits

 

 

[Bryon]

Spirituality is only a prop to justify your belief

 

Your strength comes from within, not because of who you believe in

 

 

[Bryon]

I have my own beliefs, and no-one can change them

 

 

[gareth lacey]

Religion is a crutch ,and if you look at uneducated countries around the world (3rd world,muslim ) they are the ones with the majority of people that believe the pap they spew out at services, I believe in aliens as much as god or allah who knows , there is no proof of either, religion is money maker for those that start a new one IE hillsong, to be kind and caring towards others is a normal trait in most people, I don't need some gravy stained cleric who fondles young kids to tell me that, or some mad mullah that spews hatred for Jews,gays and non believers , we have not come a long way from the dark ages if you keep believing the sxxt that they spew, oh and by the way have a great Xmas holiday

 

 

[Yenn]

Why wouldn't you believe in aliens, doesn't the halo that seems to be prevalent in Christianity remind you of a space helmet.

 

I have seen pre Aboriginal artwork, called Bradshaws in WA and that had men with halos or maybe space helmets.

 

If they were space travellers, they obviously didn't fancy this world, or maybe we are their descendents.

 

 

[facthunter]

Yikes .Holiday is derived from HOLY DAY. God works in mysterious ways . Even using atheists to spread the GOSPEL. God's spiel.

 

Believe or you die is more convincing you must admit. One of the French Kings gave the Nordics that ultimatum. They just said OK mate in Norwegian, and carried on as normal, probably raping and pillaging which sounds like a lot more fun If you have the stamina. Good business model combining recreation with profit. as long as you are on the benefitting side of the deal.. Nev

 

 

[Yenn]

Raping and pillaging. That reminds me of the Catholics.

 

But of course they only did it to youngsters or what they deemed to be backward people who had treasures.